The Official ETW Criticism Thread

[Winston]

First of all, the things i like:
- The Tech Tree ... i waited sooo hard for this
- Units can hide in buildings and behind walls ...yes yes yes
- Sea Combat ... no auto resolve diseasters anymore
- fewer fantasy units (just bought it and started the campaign ... first 30 rounds rounds and custom battles)
I reinstalled Rome too and shook my head when i saw Sreeching Women, Burning Pigs, Gladiators, Druids

What could be improved
- greater impact of terrain on the outcome of battles:
- More Terrain: Swamps for example. Nearly impossible to square with horses ... Slows infantry down
- More impact of the weather on battles: Fog reduces line of sight and accuracy of weapons. Troops move slower in the rain.
- you shouldn't be able to zoom very close to distant enemy units or see what exact unit it is.
- A line of sight. When none of your units can see an enemy unit you don't see them on the minimap.
So you can hide units behind hills or behind walls of houses.
- Some towns should look more like the real ones ... I attacked Venice and ... well i know Venice and it doesn't look like that ^^
- That was the first part

[panzer.tc]

The biggest complaint I have with ETW is the lack of so many features from previous games, and from their later games that CA didn't/couldn't include in ETW.

And lazy programming, see attachment.

[Carolus Quintus]

And lazy programming, see attachment.

He could have progeria.

As far as this game goes, I've put in eighty hours in both Empire and Napoleon, and I enjoy the latter by far. The scope of Empire with the polish of Napoleon would come close to creating perfection.

[ggggtotalwarrior]

steam.

[Indrid Cold]

well i just got it a couple days ago and so far i'm really liking it. One weird thing thats happened is i get unit lag... my fps is at like 50 but my units are lagging horrible in major fights. Terrain my camera is fine, just units are acting weird. Not sure what it is. In the last fight of act 2 i was attacking montreal and while moving up to the fort my units were lagging so bad but fps was at 50. Then when fighting broke out it was fine.

[Nosjack]

well i just got it a couple days ago and so far i'm really liking it. One weird thing thats happened is i get unit lag... my fps is at like 50 but my units are lagging horrible in major fights. Terrain my camera is fine, just units are acting weird. Not sure what it is. In the last fight of act 2 i was attacking montreal and while moving up to the fort my units were lagging so bad but fps was at 50. Then when fighting broke out it was fine.

Are you using DarthMod by any chance? I've noticed the "siege bug" is more prevalent while using it.

It's a problem with the game engine itself. The fort textures+unit textures+unit "dueling" causes the game to slow down to a crawl of 5 FPS. The only fix I can think of it installing a no-fort mod on top of DM.

Or, you could do what I do and try to starve them out, or just auto-resolve.

[DeValiere]

well i just got it a couple days ago and so far i'm really liking it. One weird thing thats happened is i get unit lag... my fps is at like 50 but my units are lagging horrible in major fights. Terrain my camera is fine, just units are acting weird. Not sure what it is. In the last fight of act 2 i was attacking montreal and while moving up to the fort my units were lagging so bad but fps was at 50. Then when fighting broke out it was fine.

While this is more suited to other threads, just to say that the cause of lagging in just about ALL fort battles is an AI bug in relation to path finding once there are holes blown in the walls. If there are AI troops on the ramparts with no means of escape due to missing sections of wall (i.e no access to stairs) then the AI cannot handle it at all. It gets into a loop whereby it keeps trying to order units with troops trapped on walls into new positions but they cannot comply and so it keeps on reissuing the same order over and over and over... and eventually you get the virtual freezing of the battle due to a massive backlog of AI movement commands. It can also happen if you order your troops to attack AI troops that are partly inaccessible as well for much the same reason.

Since I found this out, I've adapted my attack methods for sieges so as to avoid this happening if at all possible. My advice is to either use quicklime once you have it as this is the only ordinance that when hitting walls usually doesn't damage them, or a newer tactic I've been trialling (with good success thus far) is to use cannon on walls until they get to over 50% damage at which time AI should pull their troops from that part of the wall. Work over an entire side of a fort to clear the walls, THEN blow a hole in it only once ALL enemy troops are gone. Can't really take credit for this - read the bit about 50% wall damage triggering AI troop withdrawal somewhere here in the forums!

Properly managed, you should be able to conduct fort attacks without triggering the AI loop bug. Yes, it's a flaw in Empire, but a manageable one IMO.

[Hunor]

TOO PASSIVE CAI !!!

[RakeinWaiting]

having to pay for additional units....I don't pay for the legs for my chair later. I remember a time when you bought a game you bought ALL of it.

[Nosjack]

having to pay for additional units....I don't pay for the legs for my chair later. I remember a time when you bought a game you bought ALL of it.

Unfortunately DLC has become all too common these days, not just with TW.

[Sir Furlong]

Luckily we still have mods.

[Condottiere SOG]

The AI in my mod is fairly aggressive...what I don't like is the excessively awkward graphics margin...there's no reason for this 4 year old game to run my G73sw through its paces...still on the crash when it gets mousey with the RAM.

A) So Shogun has 4 seasons - easily modifiable into months or even weeks...wtf happened with Empire on that?..and how long had we been asking for this?..since MTW...the first Medieval Total War!

B) horrible graphics...Shogun is by far where Empire should have started off or been upgraded to...

C) I like the KV rules set and although I disagree with the fact that these cannot be altered(trial and error)...modding the AI is at the center of this kind of a game...why nick and sack it? Its what in previous games made guys like myself known on these forums. A real ear mark and calling card for modders to excel at.

D) Did I mention the graphics are like a hamster in an exercise wheel compared to other games...over-zealous, over-powered and unnecessary for a game of this calibre...unless your market is age 17 and under...eye candy is for modders...give us a solid game.

E) Computers are computers, AI is AI...if the guys who make "Wargame: European Escalation" can get it right, so can CA.

F) Last I studied Early Modern Warfare...forts weren't near so awkward or so high...one had a thought that it was the Age of Reason and not the High Middle Ages(LOL). When I attack a fortified city, I expect the city on the inside of the fortifications. THe only thing right about this aspect is the wooden fort, can be successfully defended by one regiment of infantry to the number of 600personnel. Proper that. Artillery forts should be lower to the ground, perhaps with and inner wall and easily maneuvered. Star Forts should be properly done in the typical fashion of the era...not some geek's idea of Warhammer40K meets Baron Munchausen...

G) The Graphics are pish-and-tiffle...why were they not upgraded...and whats the idea of the battlefield objects which when clicked stall the game to quit.

H) I am not interested in the gamer's or game-maker's notion of history...his job is to game or make games...not tell the history behind the Era represented in the game. That I can do for myself!

I) What with taking some features from previous games but not all of them...more(product) makes for less(complaint). There are features in other games which clearly belong in this one.

J) Battlefields of this Era should be at least 10 squares miles in detail...why are they so small?

K) The game is old...release the mod tools and open the code already...

I play Med2 and Shogun2 wishing that Empire was at least as good as both of these games...it enough to make one start his own company to do what apparently cannot be done here. Having retired at age 39 from public life...I have nothing but time and have considered this more than once.

[Napoleon's Scribe]

Well I like the game, but like many of my favorites I find endless things wrong with even a great game. So far TW games have included some of my favorite periods, but I was happy to see Empires come on the scene.


First I know a player changes history just by sitting at the helm, but it seems whenever historic alliances are suggested they never workout. Diplomacy needs to be more detailed, and assets like embassies and diplomats need to be included. They can give you advise and keep an eye on what is going on in foreign cities. Perhaps embassies could produce rakes and diplomats. Also what happen to the royal family? Seems in Empire having a king doesn't seem to matter much accept for producing an heir from time to time. European houses intermarry and produce alliances accordingly.

The AI continuously makes stupid moves and I remember that from Medieval Total war as well. The AI's only asset it seems is numbers. I'd like more of a challenge from the AI which always cheats to win. I'm not saying I'm a great general, but your mistakes and legions of troops shouldn't be the only reasons you loose a fight. I have fought battles where they refuse to engage and just get cut down. Other times they abandon good defenses to expose themselves to fire in open ground. Fighting in North America I captured the only ship port at the time that could produce large warships. Did the Brits act like this was a problem or try to retake it? NO and this was a game changer for the war and it was all but ignored.

Variety please! Every city looks the same, every town, farm, and forts look exactly the same whether you're fighting in Russia or Canada. This needs to stop and I'd even be willing to pay for an expansion. Rome should be a wonder for your soldiers to behold. You should see the spires of the Kremlin as you fight outside of Moscow. Even if the cities aren't historic make them reflect all that has been built during that game. Stormed one fort you've stormed them all, but you don't want to use the AI because it gives the defender all the breaks. You always know you can do much better. This to me detracts from the game along with the predictable AI. The old tactics game X-com was a lot of fun and you always saw the same buildings around the world and while I would have preferred more variety at least the AI kept the fights interesting. I like that you can occupy some buildings, but why not all?


I agree with comments about the weather it should effect the battles and movement more. Also if you're garrisoned in a city or holding a farm complex you should get bonuses for keeping your troops dry and well rested. They have to fight better than those who have slept under trees all night in the cold rain.

One criticism I continue to have about most wargames including the TW series is that you can't pickup the weapons! It costs money to outfit a unit and that makes sense, but after you've killed hundreds if not thousands in battle you should be able to take their firearms and cannon (especially when you have the guns surrounded at the end of the fight). Also your units should be able to capture standards and that ads to the their prestige. The peasant forces and Native American troops would benefit the most, because they could upgrade with captured weapons. No just using tomahawks, but first using their muskets and than charging and cutting down their enemies. Also it would be cool to see Native forces wearing the jackets and using captured gear after achieving victory. In one campaign with the Prussians I fought over Warsaw Poland six times and it changed hands several times. The town volunteers would have access to tons of better muskets and been veterans. It would also be nice to capture army supply trains and horses. We need spoils of war!

What happen to prisoners? Should be able to exchange them at least I would think.

The Armies need to be bigger. Every unit that is a 100 man strong should probably be 1000 man strong. This is the Age of Napoleon with huge armies battling over huge battle fields. The people who made the American Conquest game and the Cossack games understood that even if their execution wasn't perfect either.

All and all I'm impressed by Empire, but it's just a starting point and I hope the folks at Sega keep challenging themselves.

[Konrad Lorenz]

the lack of south america on the map. in the time period that empire plays in; the spanish, french, portugese and dutch where struggeling to get as much land colonised as possible. in the process of that colonisation attempt there were loads of slave revolts and other revolutionary attempts to gain independence (especialy after the american revolution). after some nations gained their independence, there was still some conflict potential within those nations.
gran colombia fought a war with peru and of course its war of independence together with venezuela against spain.
gran colombia disolved and its land became part of Colombia, Panama, Brazil, Costa Rica, Ecuador, Guyana, Nicaragua, Peru and Venezuela
so south america had the potential for several fractions, emerging as well as old (spanish royalists). with a lot of territorial disputes under the emerging fractions and of course potential colonies for european nations. as much as i miss a african map to colonise like most here do, i do miss a south america constantly at war due to struggles for independence and territorial disputes.

[ScarletSorceror]

I didn't find Empire as bad a game as some of your posters did. However my view may have been different had I spent £30.00 rather than £8.00 on it.

1) The one thing that does come over poorly is the graphics. Looking at the Empire you'd think it was the missing link from Medieval Total War to Rome Total War. The animation was poor on my laptop (N830 AMD Phenom II X3 and ATI Radeon HD 45250)
2) The introductory campaign didn't do agents (or at least not well enough)
3) With having up to four or more separate towns in each territory I was getting overwhelmed with managing my Empire after I'd got over ten territories. What to upgrade when became a major pain. Having a central build menu for each territory might have been more helpful. Like Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri (also a great game) managing half a dozen armies and navies per turn is fun, managing fifty or more separate armies and navies becomes a chore. I think the latter is just an occupational hazard of the genre however and can't easily be remedied.

Splitting the criticism and praise into two different threads is a bad idea. Most of your posters here who aren't frothing at the mouth will have a mix of views good and bad.

S.x.

[Rebelyell]

The biggest complaint I have with ETW is the lack of so many features from previous games, and from their later games that CA didn't/couldn't include in ETW.

And lazy programming, see attachment.

That's nothing I've seen an Ottoman Sultan as a radical revolutionary 4 year old.

[jo the greek]

lol why this thread i still on the Game was a huge failure between what should had been and is

[General Maximus]

I don't have any problem with the game, but I do have problem with Steam.

Why did they bother to add their potentially great game to Steam? I really miss my old days when I went to market, looked out for my favorite game in shops, then came home very excited and eager to play the game. Even if I didn't get the game in stock, I usually bought or selected any other game that caught my eye.

Now, guess what....

I ordered Empire and Napoleon GOTY Edition, since Napoleon's AI and graphical matter is very good but I still wanted Empire. Courier delivered the package, I installed the game, but suddenly it requires to install Steam. Alright, I thought, It might be an application which I can install in minutes due to my machine being powerful. But it took an hour to install, because it wanted to install from net not disk.

Then I installed the game, half an hour more went away. Half an hour more for Napoleon. I began to get restless and finally the game was installed. I started the game, but so what, it needed an update. An update for both games. I got very angry and nearly threw off my keyboard. But then I started the update, thinking it would be done in an hour or two at best.

Now, instead of two hours, it required whole 19 hours to update just Empire. My will was broken, and I went to watch TV and left the PC on overnight. Next day I came from school, still 10 hours remaining. I started Napoleon update which was smaller and done much quickly. Then I left the PC on for the night again. Next day, 4 hours remaining. Why? That's because Steam loaded up so many advertisements that my net became a snail. Then again after being on for night, finally the update was complete.

I tried to play, but it wants to update something again! I grew furious.....

After 2 days' more waiting, I finally was able to play.....A shameful display, CA, very shameful......

[gyabo]

I don't have any problem with the game, but I do have problem with Steam.

Why did they bother to add their potentially great game to Steam? I really miss my old days when I went to market, looked out for my favorite game in shops, then came home very excited and eager to play the game. Even if I didn't get the game in stock, I usually bought or selected any other game that caught my eye.

Now, guess what....

I ordered Empire and Napoleon GOTY Edition, since Napoleon's AI and graphical matter is very good but I still wanted Empire. Courier delivered the package, I installed the game, but suddenly it requires to install Steam. Alright, I thought, It might be an application which I can install in minutes due to my machine being powerful. But it took an hour to install, because it wanted to install from net not disk.

Then I installed the game, half an hour more went away. Half an hour more for Napoleon. I began to get restless and finally the game was installed. I started the game, but so what, it needed an update. An update for both games. I got very angry and nearly threw off my keyboard. But then I started the update, thinking it would be done in an hour or two at best.

Now, instead of two hours, it required whole 19 hours to update just Empire. My will was broken, and I went to watch TV and left the PC on overnight. Next day I came from school, still 10 hours remaining. I started Napoleon update which was smaller and done much quickly. Then I left the PC on for the night again. Next day, 4 hours remaining. Why? That's because Steam loaded up so many advertisements that my net became a snail. Then again after being on for night, finally the update was complete.

I tried to play, but it wants to update something again! I grew furious.....

After 2 days' more waiting, I finally was able to play.....A shameful display, CA, very shameful......

Lol blame the people who loves pirated games.

Seriously i totally missed the old age that you could resell your pc game or lend your pc game to your friend but now you cannot totally say that you truly own this game and easily mod the game without alot of crashes.

Also releasing some codes of the game could make a better pirated copy of this game so blame those dorks who don't legally own them but you cannot totally blame them because most pc game really have $25 or even lower value for a $60.

Moving on to other topic seriously why the hell we need to compared ETW to S2TW?

Yes i am kinda agreed the AI is too passive but wait play the very hard difficulty setting and people would complained its diplomacy .

The diplomacy will go nuts but the title of the series is called Total war so naturally will have war in all sides even between with your allies.

For god sakes most game developer totally never said they would create a very realistic game like the infamous Fable game developer.

Even S2TW have a fantasy unit called the ninja warriors who have power ranger costume.

I totally much agreed that CA would release a better AI also a better Ai for your unit.

Features i wanted to see would be adding a discipline factors into every unit seriously a militia are totally much discipline that could be compared to a regular unit.

[General Maximus]

Even S2TW have a fantasy unit called the ninja warriors who have power ranger costume.

Lol! The Kisho Ninja units may be the 'power rangers' of late medieval age, but they are good at killing indeed.