Marcus Aurelius

[Dr. Oza]

Most of us know the man.. but what of the philosopher

after reading "Meditations " i can say that he is pretty awesome

anyone else have any thoughts on him?

i guess it can be summarized as how to live life.. but more so the practical things...

ex: "Love the dicipline you know, and let it support you, entrust eveything willingly to the gods, and then make your way through life- no ones master and no onese slave"

and yet it does delve more into the theoretical philosophy of traditional thinkers

The body and its parts are a river, the soul a dream and mist, life is warfare and a journey far from home, lasting reputation is oblivion, then what can guide us?... Only philosophy...

"nothing natural is evil"

so on...

thoughts?

comments?

emotions?

... :p

[handsome pete]

it's been so long since i read his book. my avatar is one of his students.

i think i remember one of his lines as "people must work together. like hands and feet, like the upper and lower teeth"

the unfortunate thing is that i suspect a lot of it probably rhymed in the original latin.

[Zenith Darksea]

the unfortunate thing is that i suspect a lot of it probably rhymed in the original latin.

I wouldn't count on that. It wasn't poetry, and most Classical Latin poetry didn't rhyme anyway. Rhyme wouldn't become a significant feature of Latin or Greek poetry until the fourth century A.D. or thereabouts.

[Dr. Oza]

a lot of it is the traditional gosh golie ethics tho.. i like it for its simplicity and inner insight but the more realistic machiavellian thoughts are better imo

[handsome pete]

sorry your right, apparently he wrote with "harshness and plainness of his literary style," .

[Morkonan]

Most of us know the man.. but what of the philosopher

after reading "Meditations " i can say that he is pretty awesome

anyone else have any thoughts on him?....

Very awesome.

I keep a copy of Meditations on my desk. Whenever I am waiting on the computer to do something, a page to load, a download, etc.. I'll usually pick it up and flip it open.

One of the greatest things about Meditations is that it wasn't meant to be read. It wasn't "for publication." It was basically Aurelius' notes to himself.

He was a classic Stoic. There are a lot of good values there but, there are some caveats as well. Stoicism seems a bit harsh to many and not "deep" enough to satisfy some people's needs for a grander philosophy.

But, many of the concepts you find in his Meditations you will also find in other philosophical works and even works of religious nature. In fact, many are repeated down the ages with so much regularity and so much exactness that one wonders if such ideals don't touch on a set of Platonic truths - An underlying framework of "What should be." in regards to the way someone lives their life. I'm not saying "Stoicism as Religion." Even Aurelious wouldn't say that. But, parts of his personal, stoic, philosophy mirror many others even though they were widely separated and some, virtually unknown to each other. I suppose that's why Stoicism was all the rage for awhile. In fact, some would argue it continues within Christianity.

[SonOfOdin]

Yes indeed he is a fine man

This is one of my favorite quotes in general, written by him : "Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth."

[Morkonan]

Just flipping around my copy of Meditations, seeing what subject ends up under my thumb. Here's a good random quote:

"Men are born for the sake of each other; So teach or tolerate." - Marcus Aurelius "Meditations" Book 8,59

[★Bandiera Rossa☭]

I read The Meditations a few years back and they are a genuinely insightful collection of writings.

[Morkonan]

I read The Meditations a few years back and they are a genuinely insightful collection of writings.

Yes, they are. They're pretty awesome, really. He'd get multiple Pulitzers and Nobels if he had written those today.

I really enjoy seeing into the mind of a Roman Emperor, a Stoic and a person's philosophical perspective in Ancient times. Meditations taught me that only time and a few generations separate us from our ancient ancestors. They could be as intelligent, intuitive, ethical and sophisticated as any of today's brilliant thinkers. It was the first of the Ancient Works of literature that I read and I constantly thumb through it. I think it should be required reading for everyone.

[★Bandiera Rossa☭]

But you do know Morkonan, they (The Government) would wish to keep us ignorant as to make us easier to control.. why do you think they do not make genius works like Capital, the Wealth of Nations, and Les Miserables(too lazy to add the accent) mandatory (In high school)

[Morkonan]

But you do know Morkonan, they (The Government) would wish to keep us ignorant as to make us easier to control.. why do you think they do not make genius works like Capital, the Wealth of Nations, and Les Miserables(too lazy to add the accent) mandatory (In high school)

In some classes, those would be mandatory readings. Les Miserables would definitely be worty of being within the curriculum of a high-school literature class. I read it myself in High School. Das Kapital, Adam Smith's Wealth of Nations, etc.. are all a bit more complex and would definitely be within the scope of College or possibly College Preparatory schools. In advanced Economics or Political Science I would think they'd definitely be mandatory reading and Les Miserables would not be absent from any European Literature class.

The Government does not benefit by keeping people ignorant. At least, not according to Adam Smith. Most Western governments follow the Wealth of Nations as a guideline and form the basis of their labor and education around that. Human capital is the wealth of nations. No country wants an ignorant populace incapable of doing nothing more than being industrialized monkeys, mindlessly pounding hammers and pushing levers. Thus, public education was born..

Do some countries purposefully indoctrinate their populace or purposefully keep them ignorant? Of course they do. But, as far as I am concerned, that's not the case in most Western countries. While it is correct that most Western countries favor their own ideologies in comparisons between competing systems, that doesn't mean they keep their populace in ignorance regarding any others.

Note: I think Meditations would be an important inclusion in any philosophy or ancient history class. It's a window into the mind of an Emperor struggling with his own personal views on philosophy. I think it's an important piece of literature that brings ancient history to life in the mind of the reader. The Histories is important as well but, it's much more difficult to read.

[Denny Crane!]

Most of us know the man.. but what of the philosopher

after reading "Meditations " i can say that he is pretty awesome

anyone else have any thoughts on him?

I like the idea of liking him, because I know his name from holywood. Vaguely from classical studies. Let me have a look:

i guess it can be summarized as how to live life.. but more so the practical things...

ex: "Love the dicipline you know, and let it support you, entrust eveything willingly to the gods, and then make your way through life- no ones master and no onese slave"

Almost Zen though I do attest the reveration or attestation to external entities mars the usefullness of the message. Doesn't render it useless though it is an unneccessary conclusion prone to create confusion or actually literally just bloody useless.

and yet it does delve more into the theoretical philosophy of traditional thinkers

The body and its parts are a river, the soul a dream and mist, life is warfare and a journey far from home, lasting reputation is oblivion, then what can guide us?... Only philosophy...

I dunno, kind of interesting, I guess? If you strip away the metaphors and get to the message that life is introspection and external analysis I guess you get somewhere.

"nothing natural is evil"

This is genuinely good.

so on...

thoughts?

comments?

emotions?

... :p

Based on what you gave me, I'd say it is pretentious repetitions of more incisive writing though since much of that writing wasn't present in his time and he was conforming to cultural conceits then I guess it is OK. It just isn't brilliant.

It is ok.

[Ummon]

sorry your right, apparently he wrote with "harshness and plainness of his literary style," .

Which is though indifferent: latin poetry doesn't rhyme, nor does latin prose.

[G-Megas-Doux]

I read Meditations about two years ago. I still own the book but I found the outlook very simplistic and have wondered if this outlook affected the upbringing of his son Commodus.

I also find interesting the views that Machiavelli had on various Roman Emperors trying to imitate the style of rule Marcus had and why those rulers failed.

[MathiasOfAthens]

I read it first when I was in high school. I found his writing very enlightening, he was really a very bright individual. However, sometimes it seemed as if he contradicted himself. Sometimes he would praise Jupiter and other times he questions the gods existences.

[Boyar Son]

Worst philosopher I've ever heard of.