Native Names Project for BC - v0.9 RELEASED

[Boztorgai_Khan]

Wow, that's the info! Many thanks, Boztorgai! I have more for you to translate, but I will write it tomorrow.


Well, no, I'm not a new BC mod leader. We are having some kind of leadership vacuum now. Patience is what we need now, my friends.

That's my Work. Brother, Okay, We do it tomorrow.

Okay, But I See You.. Sorry You Are Friendly to everyone Everything come good

[aqua]

I just saw people have discussed too much abt the name of Turkish Sultanate,so i decided to post this

The Sultanate of Rûm was called

سلجوقیان روم

which tranlates as follows in english- Saljuqiyan-e Rum
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sultanate_of_R%C3%BBm

[wudang_clown]

I just saw people have discussed too much abt the name of Turkish Sultanate,so i decided to post this

The Sultanate of Rûm was called
which tranlates as follows in english- Saljuqiyan-e Rum
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sultanate_of_R%C3%BBm

Well, yes, at first I've been planning to use that Persian name of Rum Seljuks. I guess I'll use it now.

[Boztorgai_Khan]

I've decided to go on with next stage. I will try to replace all English names and terms like "army", "general", etc. that show up in the tooltips (except "technical" information) and in the character screen (like "King of", "Emperor", "Crown Prince" etc.). I will try to give them Arabic, Greek, Hindu etc. equivalents. I will post my work systematically to submit it for discussion - I don't know these languages, so I count on you, my friends, and your critical remarks!

Here is True Kypchak language: RED ( OLD-KYPCHAK ) BLUE ( OLD MONGOLS )



ASSASSIN - Tımmak
CAPITAL - Başqala / Paytaht
CASTLE - Sarai
CITY - Şeer
EMISSARY - Elsi / Konakbay / Konakbai / Qonaqbai
HEIR -here I want just general term for "heir" - Tegin / Tigin / Jigin - Kerey - Sad
HEIR_TITLE - here a specific title for heir, like "crown prince" or something - Tegin / Tigin / Jigin - Kerey
FACTION_LEADER - here only a general term like "king", "qan" or something - Han / Kan / Qan - Yabgu
FACTION_LEADER_TITLE - here a specific title, like Qagan or "king of the kings" - Han / Kan / Qan ->>> Hakan / Hakhan / Khagan / Kagan / Qagan = King of the Kings right.
VILLAGE - Avul
ARMY - Urda
MERCHANT - Bayan / Töre
NAMED_CHARACTER - here a title for a family member like "prince" or something - Kerey / Kerei
GENERAL - Tumen / Noyan
PRINCESS - Totay
SPY - Kösnü
CLERIC - Saman / Shaman





old MONGOLS:


ASSASSIN - Tımmak
CAPITAL - Başqala / Paytaht
CASTLE - Sarai
CITY - Şeer
EMISSARY - Elsi / Konakbay / Konakbai / Qonaqbai
HEIR -here I want just general term for "heir" - Tegin / Tigin / Jigin - Gerey - Sad
HEIR_TITLE - here a specific title for heir, like "crown prince" or something - Tegin / Tigin / Jigin - Gerei
FACTION_LEADER - here only a general term like "king", "qan" or something - Han / Kan / Qan - Yabgu
FACTION_LEADER_TITLE - here a specific title, like Qagan or "king of the kings" - Han / Kan / Qan ->>> Hakan / Hakhan / Khagan / Kagan / Qagan = King of the Kings right.
VILLAGE - Avul
ARMY - Orda
MERCHANT - Bayan
NAMED_CHARACTER - here a title for a family member like "prince" or something - Gerey / Gerei
GENERAL - Tumen / Noyan
PRINCESS - Totay / Tötay-Beqi
SPY - Kösnü
CLERIC - Saman / Shaman






BONUS GOOD SONG FOR NEXT RELEASE: KYPCHAKS and for MONGOLS - WARRIORS ( BATYRS ) SONG: ( DOMBIRA <<<->>> BATYR ) Maybe KYMYZ add on Steppes and Central Asia for the Merchants ??? - FOR MORE & MP3's ASK ME

[aqua]

Dawlat-i Saljuqian/Khwarazmshahian/Ghaznavian/Shansabani

ARMY - Lashkar
ASSASSIN - Qatil
CAPITAL - Payetakht
FORT - Sangar
WOODEN CASTLE - Qela Jubi
CASTLE - Qela
FORTRESS - Qela Nezami
CITADEL - Argh
TOWN - Kasba
LARGE TOWN - Shahar
CITY - Shaharistan
LARGE CITY - Shaharistan Hai Buzurg
HUGE CITY- Shaharistan Azeemi
DIPLOMAT- Siyasatdan
FACTION_LEADER - Sultan/Shah(for Shahs)
FACTION_LEADER_TITLE - Sultan/Shah(for Shahs)
GENERAL - Sipahsalar
GOVERNOR- Al-Hakim
HEIR -Wali-Ahad-i-Sultanate/Daulatlu Najabatlu Wali Ahad (for Shahs)
HEIR_TITLE - Wali-Ahad,Shahzada
MERCHANT - Tajir
NAMED_CHARACTER - Shahzada
NAVY-Nairavi Daryaaii
PORT- Bandergah
PRIEST- Imam
PRINCESS - Shahdukht
SPY - Jasoos
VILLAGE - Qariah/Deh/Deh/Dehak/Dehat respectively
WATCHTOWER- Burj-i-Nigahbani

SILSILAH-E-SOOMRO

ARMY - Fauj
ASSASSIN - Qatil
CAPITAL - Markaz
CASTLE - Kilo
CITY - Shaher
DIPLOMAT/EMISSARY - Siyasatdan
FACTION_LEADER - Sultan
FACTION_LEADER_TITLE - Sultan
GENERAL - Amir(due to arabic Influence)
GOVERNOR - Jagirdar
HEIR - Waris
HEIR_TITLE - Nayab-Sultan
MERCHANT - Tajir
NAMED_CHARACTER/FAMILY MEMBER/A HIGH RANK NOBLE - Mir
NAVY/FLEET - Baaheri fauj
PORT - Bandergah
PRIEST - Imam
PRINCESS - Shahbano
SPY - Jasoos
VILLAGE - ggho
WATCHTOWER/TOWER – Burj


SOLANKI RAJVANSH
NAVY/FLEET - Nauka-dal
ASSASSIN - Hathyaro
CAPITAL - Patnagar
FORT- Vasahat
WOODEN CASTLE - Lashkari Killo
CASTLE - Killo
FORTRESS - Garh
CITADEL - Nagar-Durg
VILLAGE - Gama
TOWN - Bhagol
LARGE TOWN - Shaher
CITY - Nagree
LARGE CITY - Nagar
HUGE CITY - Virat Nagar
DIPLOMAT/EMISSARY - Rajdut
HEIR - Utaraadhikari
HEIR_TITLE - Yuvraj
FACTION_LEADER - Raja
FACTION_LEADER_TITLE - Maharaja
ARMY - Sena
MERCHANT - Vepaari
NAMED_CHARACTER/FAMILY MEMBER/A HIGH RANK NOBLE - Rajkunwar
GENERAL - Senapati
PORT - Bander
PRIEST - Purohit
PRINCESS - Rajkunwari
SPY - Jasus
WATCHTOWER/TOWER – Minaro

CHUAHAN RAJYA

NAVY/FLEET - Nausena
ASSASSIN - Hathyara
CAPITAL - Rajdhani
FORT - Shivir
WOODEN CASTLE - Mahal
CASTLE - Qila
FORTRESS - Durg
CITADEL - Garh
VILLAGE - Ganva
TOWN - Basti
LARGE TOWN - Kasba
CITY - Nagar
LARGE CITY - Bada Nagar
HUGE CITY - Maha Nagar
DIPLOMAT/EMISSARY - Rajdut
HEIR - Utaraadhikari
HEIR_TITLE - Yuvraj
FACTION_LEADER - Raja
FACTION_LEADER_TITLE - Maharaja
ARMY - Sena
MERCHANT - Vaipaari
NAMED_CHARACTER/FAMILY MEMBER/A HIGH RANK NOBLE - RajKumar
GENERAL - Senapati
PORT - Bandergah
PRIEST - Purohit
PRINCESS - Rajkumari
SPY - Guptchar
WATCHTOWER/TOWER – Gummad


Saljuqiyan-e Rum

ARMY - Lashkar
ASSASSIN - Qatil
CAPITAL - Payetakht
FORT - Sangar
WOODEN CASTLE - Qela Jubi
CASTLE - Qela
FORTRESS - Qela Nezami
CITADEL - Argh
TOWN - Kasba
LARGE TOWN - Shahar
CITY - Shaharistan
LARGE CITY - Shaharistan Hai Buzurg
HUGE CITY- Shaharistan Azeemi
DIPLOMAT- Siyasatdan
FACTION_LEADER - Sultan
FACTION_LEADER_TITLE - Sultan
GENERAL - Sipahsalar
GOVERNOR- Al-Hakim
HEIR -Wali-Ahad-i-Sultanate
HEIR_TITLE - Wali-Ahad,Shahzada
MERCHANT - Tajir
NAMED_CHARACTER - Shahzada
NAVY-Bahriah
PORT- Bandergah
PRIEST- Imam
PRINCESS - Shahdukht
SPY - Jasoos
VILLAGE - Qariah
WATCHTOWER- Burj-al-miraqabat

[Boztorgai_Khan]

Dawlat-i Saljuqian/Khwarazmshahian/Ghaznavian/

CASTLE - Qila <<< Maybe for only Persian Factions but Dawlat-i Saljūqiān, Khwārezmshāhīān, Ghaznavian was not Qila for Castle it was ( Qale ).

CITY - Shaher <<< No Shaher is a Persians Name.. is Country/City >>> Shar ( Persians ) / Shahar ( in Uzbeks )



DIPLOMAT- Siyasatdan <<<->>> Siyasat Dan

FACTION_LEADER - Sultan/Shah(for Shahs) - SULTAN was used by Seljuks. Sah for Khwarezmians and Ghaznavids.

* NEW - CAPITAL = Poytaxt / Paytagt / Paytext / Serbajar ( x is in Persian for h )

FACTION_LEADER_TITLE - Sultan/Shah(for Shahs) The Game is not for Modern Persia but Old / Middle Persian right ? Then we need that language and words.

Sultan is okay, but Shah is Modern and more English write word Then we need šāh

"Shāh" (Persian: شاه) was the title of Iranian kings including the Achaemenid dynasty which unified Persia and created a vast intercontinental empire. The full title of the Achaemenid rulers was xšāyaθiya xšāyaθiyānām, "King of Kings", corresponding to Middle Persian šāhān šāh, literally "kings' king", and Modern Persian shāhanshāh (شاهنشاه).



GENERAL - Sipahsalar <<<->>> The word Mīrzā is derived from the Persian term ‘Amīrzāda which literally means "son of the ‘Amīr" or "son of the leader". ‘Amīrzād in turn consists of the Arabic title ‘Amīr (engl. Emir), meaning "commander", and the Persian suffix -zād, meaning "birth" or "lineage".

GOVERNOR- Hakim <<<->>> Al-Ḥākim

HEIR -Wali-Ahad-i-Sultanate/Wali Ahad (for Shahs) <<<->>> Daulatlu Najabatlu Vali Ahad-i-Sultanat

HEIR_TITLE - Wali-Ahad,Shahzada / Šāhzādé / Daulatlu Najabatlu Vali Ahad-i-Sultanat

NAMED_CHARACTER - Shahzada <<<->>> Šāhzādé


PRINCESS - Shahdukht <<<->>> Šāhdokht




Great Seljuks: ( Faction Leader: Sultan / Faction Leader Title: Yabgu / Faction Heir: Tegin / Faction Heir Prince Title: Sad / Princess: Beg-Kyzy ( sorry there was no name for but we can called Beg=Leader kyzy (KIZI) = Daugther )


The Great Seljuq Empire (Persian: دولت سلجوقیان) was a Persianate medieval Sunni Muslim empire, established by the Qynyq branch of Oghuz Turks that once controlled a vast area stretching from the Hindu Kush to eastern Anatolia and from Central Asia to the Persian Gulf. From their homelands near the Aral sea, the Seljuqs advanced first into Khorasan and then into mainland Persia before eventually conquering eastern Anatolia.
The Seljuq empire was founded by Tugrul Beg in 1037 after the efforts by the founder of the Seljuq dynasty, Seljuq Beg, back in the first quarter of the eleventh century. Seljuq Beg's father was in a higher position in the Oghuz Yabgu State, and gave his name both to the state and the dynasty. The Seljuqs united the fractured political scene of the Eastern Islamic world and played a key role in the first and second crusades. Highly Persianized in culture and language, the Seljuqs also played an important role in the development of the Turko-Persian tradition.


The apical ancestor of the Seljuqs was their Beg, Seljuq, who was reputed to have served in the Khazar army, under whom, circa 950 they migrated to Khwarezm, near the city of Jend also called Khujand, where they converted to Islam.



Ghaznavids: ( Faction Leader: Sultan / Faction Heir: Tegin )


The Ghaznavids (Persian: غزنویان) were a Persianate Muslim dynasty of Turkic mamluk origin which existed from 975 to 1187 and ruled much of Persia, Transoxania, and the northern parts of the Indian subcontinent. The Ghaznavid state was centered in Ghazni, a city in present Afghanistan. Due to the political and cultural influence of their predecessors - that of the Persian Samanid Empire - the originally Turkic Ghaznavids became thoroughly Persianized.

The dynasty was founded by Sebuktigin upon his succession to rule of territories centered around the city of Ghazni from his father-in-law, Alp Tigin, a break-away ex-general of the Samanid sultans. Sebuktigin's son, Shah Mahmoud, expanded the empire in the region that stretched from the Oxus river to the Indus Valley and the Indian Ocean; and in the west it reached Rayy and Hamadan. Under the reign of Mas'ud I it experienced major territorial losses. It lost its western territories to the Seljuqs in the Battle of Dandanaqan resulting in a restriction of its holdings to Afghanistan, Balochistan and the Punjab. In 1151, Sultan Bahram Shah lost Ghazni to Ala'uddin Hussain of Ghor and the capital was moved to Lahore until its subsequent capture by the Ghurids in 1186.


Two military families arose from the Turkic Slave-Guards of the Samanids — the Simjurids and Ghaznavids — who ultimately proved disastrous to the Samanids. The Simjurids received an appanage in the Kohistan region of eastern Khorasan. Alp Tigin founded the Ghaznavid fortunes when he established himself at Ghazna (modern Ghazni, Afghanistan) in 962. He and Abu al-Hasan Simjuri, as Samanid generals, competed with each other for the governorship of Khorasan and control of the Samanid empire by placing on the throne emirs they could dominate when Abdul Malik I of Samanid died in 961. But when the Samanid Emir Abdul Malik I died in 961 CE it created a succession crisis between Abdul Malik's brothers. A court party instigated by men of the scribal class—civilian ministers as contrasted with Turkic generals—rejected Alp Tigin's candidate for the Samanid throne. Mansur I was installed, and Alp Tigin prudently retired to his fief of Ghazna. The Simjurids enjoyed control of Khorasan south of the Oxus but were hard-pressed by a third great Iranian dynasty, the Buwayhids, and were unable to survive the collapse of the Samanids and the rise of the Ghaznavids.

The struggles of the Turkic slave generals for mastery of the throne with the help of shifting allegiance from the court's ministerial leaders both demonstrated and accelerated the Samanid decline. Samanid weakness attracted into Transoxania the Qarluq Turks, who had recently converted to Islam. They occupied Bukhara in 992 to establish in Transoxania the Qarakhanid, or Ilek Khanid, dynasty. Alp Tigin had been succeeded at Ghazna by Sebüktigin (died 997). Sebüktigin's son Mahmud made an agreement with the Qarakhanids whereby the Oxus was recognized as their mutual boundary.






Khwarezmian Shah's: ( Faction Leader: Sultan / Faction Leader Title: Šāh / Faction Heir: Sultanzādé / Faction Heir Prince Title: Šāhzādé / Princess: Šāhdokht )


Khwarezmian Empire, Turkic-speaking Iranian Persianate Sunni Muslim dynasty in Greater Iran during the 13th century. Also known as the Khwarezm Shahs and the Khwarezmid Empire.


The date of the founding of the empire is uncertain. Khwarezm was a province of the Ghaznavid Empire from 992 to 1041. In 1077 the governorship of the province, which now belonged to the Seljuqs, fell into the hands of Anūsh Tigin Gharchāī, a former Turkic slave of the Seljuq sultan. In 1141, the Seljuq Sultan Ahmed Sanjar was defeated by the Kara Khitay (Kara-Khitan Khanate) and Anūsh Tigin's grandson Ala ad-Din Aziz was forced to submit as a vassal to the Kara Khitay.

Sultan Ahmed Sanjar was killed in 1156. As the Seljuk state fell into chaos, the Khwarezms expanded their territories southward. In 1194, the last Sultan of the Great Seljuq Empire, Toğrül III, was defeated and killed by the Khwarezm ruler Ala ad-Din Tekish, who also freed himself of the Kara Khitay. In 1200, Takash died and was succeeded by his son, Ala ad-Din Muhammad, who by 1205 conquered the remaining parts of the Great Seljuq Empire, proclaiming himself Shah (Persian for king). He eventually became known as the Khwarezmshah. In 1212 he defeated the Gur-Khan Kutluk and conquered the lands of the Kara Khitay, now ruling a territory from the Syr Darya almost all the way to Baghdad, and from the Indus River to the Caspian Sea.





MORE COMING SOON..

[HIC SVNT LEONES]

* Great Seljuks--- Dawlat-i Saljūqiān
* Turkish Sultanate--- Dawlat-i Rūm
* GHAZNI--- Dawlat-i Ghazneviyān

I'd go with persian names and the like considering these places were both ruled by people of a heavily Persian culture. Your average Turk at this time would likely still be very.. Turkish, but your royals were obsessed with Persian culture.


* KHWAREZM--- Khwārezmshāhiyān - Dawlat-i
* GHORIDS--- Shansabani

Also of the Persian set, but they're the really persiany Persians. There are still a deal of turks among them.


* OMAN--- Imamat 'Uman
* ABBASIDS--- Al-Hilafa al-Abbasiya al-Islam


* KOJ--- Regnum Hierosolimitanum FL: Rex H: Princeps (I'd say Latin would work very well with giving you the ability to make the peoples of this diverse kingdom united only in terms of language. That way you don't have to bother with French, German, Italian, Syrian, and the like for names. Just Latinizations.)

* ROMANS--- Basileía tōn Rhomaíōn

* AYYUBIDS--- Al-Ayyubiyyun - It'd probably be a good idea to establish them as a Sultanate.



* CUMANS--- Dasht-i Qipchaq

* RAJPUTS--- Solanki Rajvansh

* SINDH--- Malikat-i Sind

* MAKURIA--- Malikat al-Muqurra: Here, the info is so vague on the Makurians I have no idea why it was chosen, not to offend. I think it'd be better to move them and go into the direction of a Ethiopian Kingdom of Dynasty as they are very similar, just one has a semitic, and better known language. Old Nubian is basically a couple of sheets of papyris and a stone tab.

* ARMENIA--- Kilikioy Haykakan T'agaworowt'iwn

* GEORGIA--- Sakartvelos Samepo

* MONGOLS--- Ikh Mongol Uls

[wudang_clown]

Guys, you are making great job, I will familiarize with your suggestions as there are few things which mesh.

@HIC SVNT LEONES
Regarding names with "dawlat" - I'd like to avoid them and use dynasties names instead (only Aqua is insisting to name Solanki "Rajvash" ). The thing is that rulers had their own interests and their subjects had their own interests. Common people were more bound by the idea of Islam than by the idea of state.

Regarding Abbasids - after Labrado's advice I'd like to name them just Al-Khilafa because adding the name of the family would suggest that there are other candidates for position of caliph. Naming that way would mean a political suicide.

As for Kypchaks - Boztorgai Khan gave better, IMO, proposition and I'll definitely use it.

@All
There are also small (I guess) differences between transcription/transliteration of particular words, like "shah"-"šāh", "Kilikioy"-"Giligiov" etc. I'm not sure what to with it. I know that "shah" looks modern, but I think it's pronounced in the same way. I will take care with that later, when we will have all terms for all factions translated.

EDIT:
Oh, and yeah, official terms for Saljuqs and Ghaznavids and Khwarazmshahs will stay Persian.

[aqua]

Regarding Abbasids - after Labrado's advice I'd like to name them just Al-Khilafa because adding the name of the family would suggest that there are other candidates for position of caliph. Naming that way would mean a political suicide.

But i think they were indeed a dynasty n hence the name Al-Khalifat-Al-Abbasiyun-Al-Islamia

The Abbasid Caliphate (Arabic: العبّاسيّون‎, al-‘Abbāsīyūn) was the third of the Islamic Caliphates of the Islamic Empire. It was ruled by the Abbasid dynasty of caliphs.

Any way the choice is urs

[aqua]

* NEW - CAPITAL = Poytaxt / Paytagt / Paytext / Serbajar ( x is in Persian for h )
I knew abt this word but was not certain whether it was used at that time or not.I m using it now.Thanx for the help.




GENERAL - Sipahsalar <<<->>> The word Mīrzā is derived from the Persian term ‘Amīrzāda which literally means "son of the ‘Amīr" or "son of the leader". ‘Amīrzād in turn consists of the Arabic title ‘Amīr (engl. Emir), meaning "commander", and the Persian suffix -zād, meaning "birth" or "lineage".
Mirza/Amirzada=son of Amir n not commander
Ami=Commander but its an arabic word


HEIR -Wali-Ahad-i-Sultanate/Wali Ahad (for Shahs) <<<->>> Daulatlu Najabatlu Vali Ahad-i-Sultanat
Dont u think it would be too long...thats why i didnt included it




Great Seljuks: ( Faction Leader: Sultan / Faction Leader Title: Yabgu / Faction Heir: Tegin / Faction Heir Prince Title: Sad / Princess: Beg-Kyzy ( sorry there was no name for but we can called Beg=Leader kyzy (KIZI) = Daugther )


By 1055 Toghrul had expanded his control all the way to Baghdad, setting himself up as the champion of the Abbasid caliph, who honored him with the title sultan.So i think they were called SULTAN.The term Tegin n Sad are turkic n i think want used during that era as seljuks used persian extensively.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seljuk

[Boztorgai_Khan]

Guys, you are making great job, I will familiarize with your suggestions as there are few things which mesh.

@HIC SVNT LEONES

As for Kypchaks - Boztorgai Khan gave better, IMO, proposition and I'll definitely use it.

@All
There are also small (I guess) differences between transcription/transliteration of particular words, like "shah"-"šāh", "Kilikioy"-"Giligiov" etc. I'm not sure what to with it. I know that "shah" looks modern, but I think it's pronounced in the same way. I will take care with that later, when we will have all terms for all factions translated.

EDIT:
Oh, and yeah, official terms for Saljuqs and Ghaznavids and Khwarazmshahs will stay Persian.

Thank You.. But if you wanted make the true languages of the factions please making then Realism. If you get English Term Modern style then we can do it that for all factions

BATIR / BAGHATUR

QYPÇAQ, QIPSAK / KYPCHAK

SALJUQ, SALSUQ / SELJUK

QAN, KAN / KHAN

SAH / SHAH

etc.....





And now for the Great guy aqua

aqua: * NEW - CAPITAL = Poytaxt / Paytagt / Paytext / Serbajar ( x is in Persian for h )

I knew abt this word but was not certain whether it was used at that time or not.I m using it now.Thanx for the help.




GENERAL - Sipahsalar <<<->>> The word Mīrzā is derived from the Persian term ‘Amīrzāda which literally means "son of the ‘Amīr" or "son of the leader". ‘Amīrzād in turn consists of the Arabic title ‘Amīr (engl. Emir), meaning "commander", and the Persian suffix -zād, meaning "birth" or "lineage".
Mirza/Amirzada=son of Amir n not commander
Ami=Commander but its an arabic word


HEIR -Wali-Ahad-i-Sultanate/Wali Ahad (for Shahs) <<<->>> Daulatlu Najabatlu Vali Ahad-i-Sultanat
Dont u think it would be too long...thats why i didnt included it




Great Seljuks: ( Faction Leader: Sultan / Faction Leader Title: Yabgu / Faction Heir: Tegin / Faction Heir Prince Title: Sad / Princess: Beg-Kyzy ( sorry there was no name for but we can called Beg=Leader kyzy (KIZI) = Daugther )


By 1055 Toghrul had expanded his control all the way to Baghdad, setting himself up as the champion of the Abbasid caliph, who honored him with the title sultan.So i think they were called SULTAN.The term Tegin n Sad are turkic n i think want used during that era as seljuks used persian extensively.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seljuk ..

So I See This MOD Start it on 1174 Persian accepted all long time islam something from Arabic culture..

And about Seljuks, Seljuks is a Turkic empire.. Turkic roots as Turkic title's. Sultanate of Rum accepted Title of Persian too but Great Seljuks accepted only Sultan and something Persians words and Culture, And writed in Persians but the Rulers, Army's, Family had Turkic Culture and the Title's.

Seljuk (Arabic: السلاجقة, Turkish: Selçuk; also Seldjuk, Seldjuq, Seljuq) (d. c. 1038) was the eponymous hero of the Seljuks. He was the son of a certain Duqaq surnamed Timuryaligh -of the iron bow- and either the chief or an eminent member from the Kınık tribe of the Oghuz Turks. In about 985 the Seljuk clan split off from the bulk of the Tokuz-Oghuz, a confederacy of nine clans long settled between the Aral and Caspian Seas, and set up camp on the right bank of the lower Syr Darya(Jaxartes), in the direction of Jend, near Kzyl Orda in present day south-central Kazakhstan where they were converted to Islam.

Tuğrul united the Turkomen warriors of the Great Eurasian Steppes into a confederacy of tribes.


Oghuz Yabgu State, was a Turkish state, founded by Oghuz Turks in the 10th century, located geographically in an area between the east coasts of Hazar see and Aral lake. The state was found in Eni-Kent which was a yayla for Oghuz Turks. The state was reigned by the ruler of the Oghuz Turks with the title of Yabgu which is similar with other Turkish ruling titles such as Khan, Giray, and Hakan but with a range below Hakan. The army was commanded by Subaşı. "Sü" means "Army" in Turkish and "başı" is for "the head of" or "the ruler of"

The state did not last long. Another Turkic budun Kimeks, ended the state by the 12th century. By the time, Selçuk Bey and his Kınık tribe (boy) headed Iran to found their own Muslim state which will become
Great Seljuq Empire in the future.



The Oghuz (variously known as Ghuzz, Guozz, Kuz, Oguz, Oğuz, Okuz, Oufoi, Ouz, Ouzoi, Torks, Turkmen, Uguz, Uğuz, and Uz ) were a group of Turkic peoples. In the ninth century the Oghuz Turks from the Aral steppes drove the Pecheneg Turks of the Emba region and the River Ural toward the west. In the tenth century they inhabited the steppe of the rivers Sari-su, Turgai, and Emba to the north of Lake Balkhash of modern day Kazakhstan. A clan of this nation, the Seljuks, embraced Islam and in the eleventh century entered Persia, where it founded the Great Seljuk Empire.

Similarly, in the eleventh century a Tengriist Oghuz clan—referred to as Uzes or Torks in the Russian chronicles—overthrew Pecheneg supremacy in the Russian steppe. Harried by another Turkic horde, the Kipchaks—a branch of the Kimaks of the middle Irtysh or of the Ob—these Oghuz penetrated as far as the lower Danube, crossed it and invaded the Balkans, where they were either crushed or struck down by an outbreak of plague, causing the survivors either to flee or to join the Byzantine imperial forces as mercenaries (1065).

The Oghuz seem to have been related to the Pechenegs, some of whom were clean-shaven and others of whom had small 'goatee' beards. According to the book Attila and the Nomad Hordes, "Like the Kimaks they set up many carved wooden funerary statues surrounded by simple stone balbal monoliths." The authors of the book go on to note that "Those Uzes or Torks who settled along the Russian frontier were gradually Slavicized though they also played a leading role as cavalry in twelfth and early thirteenth century Russian armies where they were known as Black Hats.... Oghuz warriors served in almost all Islamic armies of the Middle East from the eleventh century onwards, in Byzantium from the ninth century, and even in Spain and Morocco." In later centuries, they adapted and applied their own traditions and institutions to the ends of the Islamic world and emerged as empire-builders with a constructive sense of statecraft.

Linguistically, the Oghuz are listed together with the old Kimaks of the middle Yenisei of the Ob, the old Kipchaks who later emigrated to southern Russia, and the modern Kirghiz in one particular Turkic group, distinguished from the rest by the mutation of the initial y sound to j (dj).

"The term 'Oghuz' was gradually supplanted among the Turks themselves by Türkmen, 'Turcoman', from the mid tenth century on, a process which was completed by the beginning of the thirteenth."

"The Ottoman dynasty, who gradually took over Anatolia after the fall of the Seljuks, toward the end of the thirteenth century, led an army that was also predominantly Oghuz."




What I give it about Kypchaks, Great Seljuks, Ghaznavids and Khwarezmians is the True..


If Seljuks had Change the Title's too in Persians how was it today possible that most now that Seljuks was from Oghuz tribes ? How know the Seljuks Leaders Prince's and the Generals about Oghuz tribes ??

Read More about Ural-Altaic CULTURE and HISTORY.

Ural-Altaic people can converted to another religion can accepted language etc. But Names and Titles never.




Great Seljuks: ( Faction Leader: Sultan / Faction Leader Title: Yabgu / Faction Heir: Tegin / Faction Heir Prince Title: Sad / Princess: Beg-Kyzy ( sorry there was no name for but we can called Beg=Leader kyzy (KIZI) = Daugther )

Ghaznavids: ( Faction Leader: Sultan / Faction Heir: Tegin )

Khwarezmian Shah's: ( Faction Leader: Sultan / Faction Leader Title: Šāh / Faction Heir: Sultanzādé / Faction Heir Prince Title: Šāhzādé / Princess: Šāhdokht )




Kypchaks: ( Faction Leader: Khan ( Kan, Qan ) / Faction Leader Title: Khagan ( Kagan, Qaqan ) / Faction Heir: Tigin / Faction Heir Prince Title: Kerey / Princess: Tötay / General: Tumen / Noyan )


Mongols: ( Faction Leader: Khan ( Kan, Qan ) / Faction Leader Title: Khagan ( Kagan, Qaqan ) / Faction Heir: Jigin / Faction Heir Prince Title: Gerei / Princess: Tötay / General: Tumen / Noyan )




I Think You Understand it now.

[wudang_clown]

Well, Boztorgai, it wasn't a mystery that Saljuqs were from Oghuz Turks. Neither they themselves not their Persian officials didn't try to hide this fact. Saljuqs were indeed highly persianized as they were strangers in Persia. They also acquired many different titles:

"The ‘Abbasid bestowed on Toghril the honorific titles rukn al-dawla (Pillar of the State), qasim amir al-mu’minin (Partner of the Commander of the Faithful) and malik al-mashriq wa ‘l-maghrib (King of the East and West)."

Toghril was also appointed as amir of Khurasan (after the battle of Dandanqan).

"Honorific titles of ‘Adud al-Dawla and Diya’ al-Din were granted by the ‘Abbasid caliph to Alp Arslan."

"Sanjar continued to acknowledge his constitutional dependence on the supreme Sultan Muhammad, who enjoyed on his coins the title al-sultan al-mu’azzam, and was content to style himself on coins malik al-mashriq (King of the East)."

"Sultans had always felt certain obligations towards these kinsfolk of theirs, often making special administrative arrangements for them in the regions they were particularly numerous, appointing special shihnas and ru’asa’ (sing. ra’is) (chiefs) to act as a channels of communication between the nomads and the Seljuq state, whose dominating Perso-Islamic ethos was largely alien to the Turkmens."

"Provincial government (wilayat, iyalat) was exercised through centrally appointed officials with designations like wali, na’ib, shihna or ra’is. The last of these had an additional role as the representative of the urban notables – from the leading families of whom the ra’is was generally chosen – and of his fellow-townsmen vis-à-vis the central government, above all in matters relating to taxation."

These are more or less exact excerpts from historical books about Saljuq state. They were indeed Oghuz Turks, but to rule Persians effectively they had to resort to Persian culture because they were strangers.

With all due respect to your knowledge, Boztorgai, Saljuqs will stay Persian because they were using Persian names in official papers and on coins. And the purpose of NNP is to give official terminology.

I hope this won't discourage you from contributing because your contribution is already huge and maybe NNP wouldn't be possible without your help.

[Boztorgai_Khan]

Well, Boztorgai, it wasn't a mystery that Saljuqs were from Oghuz Turks. Neither they themselves not their Persian officials didn't try to hide this fact. Saljuqs were indeed highly persianized as they were strangers in Persia. They also acquired many different titles:

"The ‘Abbasid bestowed on Toghril the honorific titles rukn al-dawla (Pillar of the State), qasim amir al-mu’minin (Partner of the Commander of the Faithful) and malik al-mashriq wa ‘l-maghrib (King of the East and West)."

Toghril was also appointed as amir of Khurasan (after the battle of Dandanqan).

"Honorific titles of ‘Adud al-Dawla and Diya’ al-Din were granted by the ‘Abbasid caliph to Alp Arslan."

"Sanjar continued to acknowledge his constitutional dependence on the supreme Sultan Muhammad, who enjoyed on his coins the title al-sultan al-mu’azzam, and was content to style himself on coins malik al-mashriq (King of the East)."

"Sultans had always felt certain obligations towards these kinsfolk of theirs, often making special administrative arrangements for them in the regions they were particularly numerous, appointing special shihnas and ru’asa’ (sing. ra’is) (chiefs) to act as a channels of communication between the nomads and the Seljuq state, whose dominating Perso-Islamic ethos was largely alien to the Turkmens."

"Provincial government (wilayat, iyalat) was exercised through centrally appointed officials with designations like wali, na’ib, shihna or ra’is. The last of these had an additional role as the representative of the urban notables – from the leading families of whom the ra’is was generally chosen – and of his fellow-townsmen vis-à-vis the central government, above all in matters relating to taxation."

These are more or less exact excerpts from historical books about Saljuq state. They were indeed Oghuz Turks, but to rule Persians effectively they had to resort to Persian culture because they were strangers.

With all due respect to your knowledge, Boztorgai, Saljuqs will stay Persian because they were using Persian names in official papers and on coins. And the purpose of NNP is to give official terminology.

I hope this won't discourage you from contributing because your contribution is already huge and maybe NNP wouldn't be possible without your help.

They all is True.. I know that about papers and coins. But for the Titles no. If you look it more in Seljuks history then see you too the Titles as for Prince Tegin as Name for male

But you wanted make everything in Persians by Great Seljuks, Then we can called a Persian Faction.
That Seljuks writed persians words in papers and coins will not telling that titles too in Persians is.

But this is your Mod you want this so then is this so.

[wudang_clown]

They all is True.. I know that about papers and coins. But for the Titles no. If you look it more in Seljuks history then see you too the Titles as for Prince Tegin as Name for male

Well, yes, that's true... I'll rethink it. We have much time for this. NNP is WIP still.

[Boztorgai_Khan]

Well, yes, that's true... I'll rethink it. We have much time for this. NNP is WIP still.

Hehe, No No Look if you want in unrealism titles for Seljuks, Ghaznavids and Khwarezmians that is not problem for me I want only help you with that Realism Titles. I think you want make persians guys happy.

But Kypchaks and Mongols are important for me. That 2 Factions must 100% REALISM, Titles, Names History. Everything.


BTW: Sorry AND GOOD MUSIC FOR KYPCHAKS and MONGOLS - ( I HAVE EVERYTHING FOR YOU / BC TEAM ) I'am too a BC MEMBER So SPECIAL FOR BC TEAM I Send you from PM. its only for BC MOD.

[Qarama]

did you guys knew that for example the Timurid army and generals etc used turkic names like binbashi etc?
I'm not sure if the seljuq army also had only persian names. What about the leaders for example Alparslan or Kilich Arslan these are turkish names. It is true that the Seljuqs were influenced by the persians but i don't think that they were totaly persianized. Persian was the language of art and poems. But the turks later would forget their native language then. Don't forget Shah Ismail or Babur which all wrote and spoke in turkish.

[wudang_clown]

did you guys knew that for example the Timurid army and generals etc used turkic names like binbashi etc?
I'm not sure if the seljuq army also had only persian names. What about the leaders for example Alparslan or Kilich Arslan these are turkish names. It is true that the Seljuqs were influenced by the persians but i don't think that they were totaly persianized. Persian was the language of art and poems. But the turks later would forget their native language then. Don't forget Shah Ismail or Babur which all wrote and spoke in turkish.

You're right. But "names" in the Native Names Project mean the name of object or title, not a name of person. Maybe I should have name it otherwise, like "terminology".

Next thing is, I wanted to represent the terminology used in official state papers and coins etc. Administration of Saljuq state was highly persianized, hence Persian terminology. If you look in names.txt however, you'll see that names of Saljuq characters are still Turkic.

[Boztorgai_Khan]

Can you show me an evidence that the Seljuqs & Ghaznavids used persian titles ??

I can show you, but can you do that too ???


Sultan for Faction Leader okay, But for Faction Heir, Princess and General ???
Faction Heir, Princess and General must in Turkic titles sorry..

[nurhak]

dude not too persian im sure they had some persian influence but you guys talk like we were the persians, damn it my fav mod is destroyed

[wudang_clown]

Can you show me an evidence that the Seljuqs & Ghaznavids used persian titles ??

I can show you, but can you do that too ???


Sultan for Faction Leader okay, But for Faction Heir, Princess and General ???
Faction Heir, Princess and General must in Turkic titles sorry..

Well, there was a guy, Oghuz Turk, his name was Shah Malik ("King King" as I understand it), rather not Turkic.
One more example:
"Politically the Saljuq empire was a loose confederation of semi-independent kingdoms over which the sultan exercised nominal authority. Saljuq princes were known as maliks in contradistinction to the paramount ruler, the sultan. Only for a brief period towards the end of Malik-Shah's reign was any degree of unity achieved". - Cambridge History of Iran


And, take it easy, Boztorgai. I've said that administration was persianized, not terms for "princess" and "prince". I'm aware of your advices.

dude not too persian im sure they had some persian influence but you guys talk like we were the persians, damn it my fav mod is destroyed

Geez, guys, calm down, seriously...

The mod isn't destroyed. My (our) NNP isn't in the main package (and I guess it won't be for a while, if ever). You don't have to use "my" mod, Nurhak.