Curia Hostilia: Consulate of Marcellinus/Falco

[cnaeus]

i think we need to put more effort in the regions that are at risk and a little less in the regions that are very firmly under our controll, but i dont state that we should do the exact opposite...i think focusing on italy is good...but dont overdo it...we need to get a firm grip on all our lands...and that includes the ones that are not that loyal to us.....yet

[Raglan]

I am shocked, the Quaestor advatises spending our entire treasury in just one term, on top of our losses?

one hundred thousand denari, that is an aweful lot to spend. I agree to sprnding some, but all of it?

It would surely be better to leave some of the via (for you new guys via is roads) til next season, thus spreading out our costs.

[Ozy]

Senators, first of, I only wish to say that I support this man's plan. To spend money in Italy and our core provinces ensure that our investment will bring us fruits. A safer bet, so to speak. While the provinces do need investment, the main reason for the unrest in them is that legions are distributed in single cities, rather than through out the different parts of the province. Therefore, some little money to invest in key settlements and new troop recruitment, along with troop redistribution should be enough to mantain our provinces in good order.

Finally, the reason for such a large investment is simple: Our full treasury will be depleted very soon anyways. To use all our funds for this quite simply makes use of money that will be gone anyways, money that will disappear in a matter of months.

OOC: Just like the 280 BC campaign, in 100 bc you are given lots of troops and money at the very beginning, only to start losing it quickly over the course of a year. The player (or us, in this case) has to use the money asap, and the troops to conquer or defend himself from enemies while the financial problems are over, otherwise we will go to red numbers and nothing will get done.

[Junius]

The young Lucius Geganius Macerinus was sitting at the back of the Senate when he heard the proposition from the Quaestor. Not wanting to make a mistake, or say something stupid, he waited until some other Senators had spoken first, and then rose in his first address to the Senate.

"Many of you Senators may not know me. In fact, I would hazard to be that none of you did before my recent return to Rome. Though some may see this as a disadvantage, it will at least allow you to hear my words and contemplate my opinion and ideas without bias.

The amount of money we are losing shows us that we are in a deep crisis. We can not expect it to right itself, so we cannot afford any inaction. Unless we see a complete overhaul of our infrastructure neither can we expect much to change. The state cannot be seen to be doing nothing, paralysed by fear over making a wrong step. If we have confidence in what we do, so will the people. With renewed confidence in our economy it will become better.

I support the plans the Quaestor has submitted. A large crisis requires a large solution. The investment we make now will not only help our own generation, but will be a spring board for the continued greatness of Roman generations to come.'

[Crozimodo]

I do not believe we should spend almost the entirety of out treasury in one term, some at least must be left in reserve to deal with unforseen problems.

Furthermore I would support developing our provinces such as Cispaline Gaul,

Improving roads and agriculture there could guarantee an economic boon.

As for unrest we should redistibute our forces to secure loyalty.

And of course we cannot forget the gods! I believe that at least one temple should be built or improved as to provide us with the good will of the gods.

Maybe a new temple should be placed in one of the provinces to keep the people happy.

[Raglan]

OOC: Just like the 280 BC campaign, in 100 bc you are given lots of troops and money at the very beginning, only to start losing it quickly over the course of a year. The player (or us, in this case) has to use the money asap, and the troops to conquer or defend himself from enemies while the financial problems are over, otherwise we will go to red numbers and nothing will get done.

ooc; i know this but i find it unrealsitic that someone wouldn't object to spending all of there money in one go. If you only had 5 pounds and were told to spend it all you'd be annoyed let alone 100,000 denari

ic; Senators i do not object to the plans, reform is needed. But it is the unwise man who spends EVERYTHING. Many of us own lands, many of us have invested in buisness. But how willing would we be if instead of a portion we had to invest all of it?

It is not the plans it is the management of the money overall that conserns me.

With the raising in taxes proposed it will balance the deficit and allow us to spread the cost. Other than our treasury we have no overly pressing demands at the moment so i think it little hardship to spread the costs over two terms, and allowing us some spare incase something pressing does occur.

[Ozy]

Senators, we need to secure the money by investing it, money left inside our treasure is money that will be gone soon! Trust our Quaestor's report, hard times will come to Rome, whether we are ready or not. If we invest it all now, maybe, just maybe, by the start of the next year, we will have some money back.

The way I see it, if we invest it all we will have good chances of obtaining a high revenue. If we don't, we will have no chances of recovering.

I agree, however, with senator Festinus's complain about the lack of focus in our gods. Perhaps the Pontifex Maximus should have a word on this, and secure some money to be used for the construction or improvement of our temples.

[Hesus de bodemloze]

Senators we need a strong basis to become an economical power, it might be best to spend the money to improve our situation. We will need it to be strong.

[Imperial Eagle]

My fellow senators, I suggest that the wealthier citizens could be given an opportunity to become state mercenaries in foreign service, with the payment split between the soldiers and the Roman state. The warring Gallic tribes in the north seem like an excellent client for any such mercenaries.

Also, the high cost for the mercenaries would drain the Gauls' economic resources, making them easier to conquer in the long run. Finally, if one tribe begins to grow too powerful, then we could cut off mercenary service to that entity, keeping the Gauls, or any other group, from achieving unity.

[Junius]

The outflow of money shows no signs of abating, and will not abate unless action is taken. We need to secure our economic ability, and better to do that during this time of relative peace. When war comes, as it is inevitable, we need to be in a strong position to feed and pay our legions. If we can invest now, we will reap the rewards down the line.

The Senator must be mad to suggest that Romans fight not for their motherland, but for that of barbarians. He wishes we fight for money, like a low life brigand, of foreign kings. How is this not treason? To say, in these hallowed halls, that Romans should not fight for Rome, but should bleed and die for a tyrant, a king, and one of barbarians at that.

[Hesus de bodemloze]

Quintus looked surprised to the man, was he being serious? What has this to do with our situation.

Senator what are you talking about, why should we hire mercenaries? Are we at war with Gaul? I don' t believe so.

[Crozimodo]

Senator I believe you mis-interpret.

Senator Sulpicius suggests that we offer the opportunity for wealthy soldiers to be hired as mercenaries by gallic tribes and the pay is split between the soldiers.

Turning to Sulpicius,

Senator I don't believe you have thought this through, would you risk your life for a gaul?

Our men will not die for some foreign king, on foreign soil in a petty squabble between tribes that had nothing to do with Rome!

These people are not even our allies! Let them tear themselves to shreds it is what keeps them weak and away from Rome.

No roman will ever bow his head before a king not while this republic stands.

NEVER A TYRANT! NEVER A KING! LONG LIVE THE REPUBLIC! Festinius barked his fist punching the air.

[Raglan]

Festinus, i appreciate your enthusiasm, but please keep it in order.

My own instinct to this... At first i think no!, but then do not the spartans serve at times as mercanaries - when war in Sparta is scarce and they want to keep themselves sharp.

I can see the reasons behind this, if i look hard enough. But i simply do not think this is Roman

[Crozimodo]

Point taken senator.

But you're right this is not something I believe we have ever done and I don't think we shall start to do.

Our economic problems need to be dealt with by us or they will always be lurking there.

I would request that the Quaestor discuss his reasoning behind his beliefs with us.

Until then I cannot support spending all of our money this term it is too big a risk.

[Imperial Eagle]

However, why did Sparta fall from power? Because it failed to adjust to it's situation. I belive it would be for the good of Rome for money to enter through mercenary service, should it be necessary. Besides, there would be very strict conditions of mercenary use.

I do agree that we need to develop infrastructure as well.
And we would only need to use this mercenary plan if Rome was in severe financial need.

[Raglan]

Senator Marcellinus, patience we are discussing the Quaestors report and shall resume to this shortly.

As to the report, i have had my say but feel little agreement. Thus i am prepared to put it to vote, if you will support it.

And then we will return to Marcellinus's issue

[Crozimodo]

Supported put it to vote.

[Raglan]

ooc; actually it was only like four hours ago, lets give people who haven't been on a chance. I'll put it up later

[Crozimodo]

OOC: No worries I should be able to vote for myself tomorrow think it'll of been a week.

[Hesus de bodemloze]

Since when do we use Roman lives as throw away products, let Roman men die for Gallic goals? We should be the once hiring them to do the fighting in our place.

No, no Roman may fight for barbarian, i personally will veto any motion that be brought up. Be warned senators.