Recommend me a paradox please

**Sevasti** · July 20, 2009, 12:15 PM

I have a feeling I'm going to regret this one way or the other but here goes.

I briefly tried EU:ROME. Did not like it but in all honesty I did not spend enough time to get a grip around the game mechanics so... Anyway, I immensely enjoy strategy games and seeing that there's nothing new on the horizon that interests me I've decided to give Paradox another shot. However there are some specific things I'm looking for:

* Ability to play, if not the whole, then at least large parts of the world. I'd like to see all continents included.
* In-depth diplomatic, economic and trading options. Trade routes, different goods, actual diplomacy etc.
* Playtime somewhere between 1600 to the beginning of the 1900's. I'd like to see the colonialism, imperialism etc. Maybe re-enact the opium wars, those kind of things.

Now, I've been looking around at the official forums but it's hard to get a good overview about the different games. Since I've seen so many replies in the Empires section about how CA should have added diplomatic depth like the Paradox games, I thought to myself that you guys could shed some light.

I've been looking at EU3 and The whole world mod. Is it any good? Does it add distinct features to the different nations or are they all just clones?
I've also been looking at Victoria, it's expansion and mod. Looks like this could be the one I'm looking for but seeing that it's somewhat old maybe EU3 has already covered all that made Victoria good from the beginning? I'd rather suffer through a steep learning curve if the reward is greater, than playing an easier game with inferior game mechanics.

I just wan't to be able to force my way upon smaller nations across the globe with a mighty trading empire and for the next campaign maybe switch roles and play as an Asian nation just struggling to survive when the Europeans starts to colonize my home turf.

Please recommend me something, or I'm forever doomed to just browse through thread after thread in the official forum while getting no wiser on the subject at all.

Edit: Also feel free to recommend me mods.

**Ishoss** · July 20, 2009, 01:21 PM

I think you want Victoria, though I'd reccomend you EUIII as well.

**Kanaric** · July 20, 2009, 01:22 PM

victoria if you can withstand the learning curved

**Sevasti** · July 20, 2009, 01:48 PM

So what are the key differences between Victoria and EUIII? Both games seem to fit the time frame. I'm not sure about the nations, I can't seem to find a list of playable factions. Diplomacy, trading, economics? Does these mechanics have any significant differences?

**Ishoss** · July 20, 2009, 02:02 PM

Originally Posted by Sevasti

So what are the key differences between Victoria and EUIII? Both games seem to fit the time frame. I'm not sure about the nations, I can't seem to find a list of playable factions. Diplomacy, trading, economics? Does these mechanics have any significant differences?

EUIII=colonization
Vicky=Economy

**Sevasti** · July 20, 2009, 02:12 PM

Thanks for your answers. It seems that I'll delve into Victoria then. It's just €7.49 at Gamersgate btw.

**Pious Agnost** · July 21, 2009, 03:45 AM

If you're going to for Victoria, it's a very good game but the learning curve is freakishly hard.

**Dodge** · July 21, 2009, 05:30 AM

Make sure you get the expansion, otherwise you shouldn't bother.

**Sevasti** · July 21, 2009, 02:51 PM

Got the expansion as well and you're right, it's freakishly hard trying to acquaint oneself with the game. At least I've figured out how to keep the budget on plus but I have no real clue what to invest it in since I don't have the resources to build any factories. I'm a bit confused with the trading system, actually I can't really buy anything, only sell it seems.

But something that maybe one of you could answer me is:
Why does the diplomatic options only seem to work sporadic? Sometimes it's all fine and dandy, other times it just says I lack the required actions to do it?

I asked for it, I know.

But I refuse to buckle under just yet.

**Hippolord** · July 21, 2009, 02:53 PM

Heres a Paradox:

If you go back in time and kill your grandfather, does that mean that you no longer exsist?

Which means that you could have never killed him, which means your alive, which means you could kill him, which means your not alive etc.

Paradox!

On Topic:

EU III Is good i don;t know many Paradox games, but i think that one has already been suggested... Oh well i vouch for EUIII

**Pious Agnost** · July 21, 2009, 11:19 PM

Going back in time, itself, is a paradox

**Augustus Lucifer** · July 22, 2009, 07:00 PM

Personally I enjoy EUIII(with both expansions, without it's kinda bad) with the MMP or WWM mods. I haven't played Vicky but it seems to be more complex yet have less versatility of options. I like EUIII because you can forge a land empire, pursue naval supremacy, create a trade dominion, or just set some RP goals like a migration around the world or the freeing of nations that generally do bad and giving them a bunch of territory. There's not so many game mechanics that you can't do fun and wacky things, but there's enough that you have to consider each decision and every empire you craft(if not intended for world domination) should turn out different.

I wouldn't recommend HOI2, it's mainly about production and military, and can be quite boring as a non-major nation, especially in Europe. Never played Crusader Kings but it's not the era you're looking for.

**Arn** · July 23, 2009, 12:58 PM

Eu III with both expansions is really great actually. So many different countries to play and so many different things to try to accomplish.

**Raglan** · July 23, 2009, 05:00 PM

judgeing by your comments in the op i'd say that victoria is the one for you. It involves a lot of learning, so i'd recommending having a look on the paradox forum for the tutorial mod. But it is well worth it after you've gotten used to it

**liuzg150181** · July 24, 2009, 06:43 AM

Originally Posted by LordRaglan

judgeing by your comments in the op i'd say that victoria is the one for you. It involves a lot of learning, so i'd recommending having a look on the paradox forum for the tutorial mod. But it is well worth it after you've gotten used to it

By recommending Victoria to an initiate to Paradox game I think you are going to crumble his sanity and jest into dust.

Amongst all the Paradox game I'd recommend EU3 & its 2 expansion, followed by Crusader King, the former has depth w/o being overtly complex, while the latter is simply fun to play, if you dont mind keeping track of your dynasty.

**Sevasti** · July 24, 2009, 11:40 AM

Well, to be honest, trying to learn Victoria has been an experience similar to banging my head against a brick wall.

For every mechanic I get some vague grasp on there's always another new one that I'm unaware of and that's just waiting to plunge my nation into disaster. I won't give in just yet, at least I'm learning something new for every new session.

**Scipio Afracanis** · July 28, 2009, 03:52 PM

I want to go into Victoria sometime also, abut I tried EU3 complete 1st and I love it.
So many options and things that can happen every game....... very fun, the learning curve wasn't to bad, i am not a pro by any means but I give the AI some beatings once in a while.

Crusader Kings looks and sounds fun also.

Is Rome good? I played the demo when it 1st came out and I was underwhelmed,seemed like an EU3 knockoff. Only a demo though.

**hellheaven1987** · July 29, 2009, 12:00 AM

Personally I think it depends on what you want.

Military - Heart of Iron series.

Colonization - EUIII.

Economy - Victoria.

Dynasty role-play - Crusaders King.

Want a mixture of all but not unique - Rome.

Basically that is the area each game focuses; other than that each game generally is not good for other type of experience, such as play military route in EU, which you may soon discover there are not much logic behind compare with Heart of Iron.