Some tips on Gondor ...
Gondor - tips and tricks from game experience
After my 3rd Gondor campaign has finished at turn 132 I thought to share some experience. Note that finished means there is NO Mordor unit or settlement left, although the game does not acknowledge that and thus I am unable to fulfill the campaign win prerequisites. This seems to be persistent - had the same with Isengard and Mordor as High Elves.
Summary
Gondor has to face 2 enemies more or less alone (Mordor and Harad) but MUST still develop the economy before it can successfully launch major attack campaigns. Some practical experience feedback (hard/hard, I am not in for masochism :-)). Gondor is the only "good" campaigner able to fulfill the long campaign targets without having to attack another "good" faction - Mordor, Harad and parts of Rhun provide enough expansion space. In the first ca. 30 to 80 turns always remind yourself that a successful fight against Mordor is your by far prime target, no matter if Rohan slowly dies or Harad grows strong as long as you steadily wear down Mordor.
Economy
First - change capital to Tarnost, the difference will be a desperately needed 1,000 Florins. Per turn.
Second, decide early on which towns to develop fast and which not. The fast developers should be on normal or even low taxes, else on high or very high. Target is to have about 4,000 Fl. as available money per turn up to roughly turn 20. My suggestion for fast developers would be Linhir and/or Pelargir, they can make you awesome money midgame when ports and trade infrastructure has been developed.
Third, make it a rule to dedicate 2/3rd of each turns income to development on average (emergency cases excluded of course). This means the faction comparison will have you in 5th place or below on turn 20 with 50% of the strongest factions strength in military, which is just fine :-).
Fourth - after securing Minas Morgul, Cair Anros etc. switch capital to Linhir for some 200 Florins plus again.
Fifth - build all militia buildings (including stables) anywhere midterm. The garrison allowance for up to 5 free units can spare you enormous amounts of money while parking units in towns and forts for various reasons.
Target order
First - secure E. and W. Osgiliath by gathering and using all available forces as fast as possible from Lossarnach, Pelargir, Minas Tirith, Erech etc. These cities alone are worth 600 Fl. each without a Fl. invested, have huge stone walls already built and serve as your main staging stations (or a dedicated place of defence) for the next 30 to 50 turns. Partly developed (and manpower filled again) they can easily make you a 2,500 Florins each by turn 60. Target: Turn 6 for both latest.
Second - secure Annulond in the outer west as fast as possible by gathering forces from Lond Galen etc. The town is defended by 6 bandit militia, which means, 5 units + General is more than enough if 2+ militia archers are included. Target (long distances): Between turn 8 and 12.
Third - in between the inevitable Orc incursions into Ithilien from Minas Morgul try to snatch Emyn Arnen (target: turn 12) and a bit later (or earlier depending on circumstances) Cair Andros. Between Emyn Arnen, Osgiliath and Cair Andros you can exchange units so fast that one full stack distributed between these three can easily hold the equivalent of 2,5 stacks invading from which side ever (this is without Hennen Amun if that proves too dangerous). Make paved roads a priority for West Osgiliath and Minas Tirith. If you are able to conquer Hennen Amun beore turn 20 to 30 - DO SO. At that time it still has a fairly large Dunedain population, you may build units right away.
Fourth - get spies at exactly 2 places: Just behind the fort behind Minas Morgul, at the spot where the Morgul pass widens and the road turns north. Ideal place to have a loook on forces in Morgul and anything approaching. The second spy should be placed just a bit over the river pasing north of Hennen Amun, again the perfect place to have an eye on anything approaching from Black Gate and surrounding.
Fifth - build watchtowers along your coast (starting to the south of Linhir where the Anduin may be passed), preferably with Generals you want to use in battle (they may acquire the logistics traits which is near a necessity for any army with siege equipment later).
Done at turn 20? Congrats. And now - if you are really bold, good at field battles AND siege defences - catch Minas Morgul! Sequence of events - win a field battle against the latest Mordor army between Osgiliath and Minas by leaving NO survivors and sustaining minimal losses. Now either attack the little stack the AI may stupidly have placed just before Minas to enforce a field battle with the Morgul garrison (preferred) and kill the Nazghul General at ALL costs. OR (more likely) siege Minas (yes, that means the garrison script will provide Mordor with x units plus inside) and make sure your stack is full the next turn. Wait for the inevitable reinforcement to force you into a field battle (forcing the Minas garrison OUT at the same time) and win this battle. Minas is yours. Now you ONLY (!) have to survive the first sieges by the reinforcement spawn of elite Mordor units including 2 battle trolls 2 turns later. I did it with militia alone and I am not a genius in battles. After that you of course have to prepare for series of sieges until you are ready to counterattack.
BUT from now on it´s just a matter of time. Continue to build forces and economy steadily, your main goal is to have at least one full (spare) attack stack to invade Mordor further and another one to either harrass or conquer in Harad. By turn 60 to 80 already you should feel the inevitable win, no matter how long the execution (due to march times) still will need. If Harad gets annoying in between, gather a stack of 8 to 10 units including one catapult, load on boats, sail along Harads coast and sack any city there (selling EVERYTHING sellable in it). After that spee (especially if applying that on Harads major city Umbar) you will really feel the pressure diminishing.
Hope for an early crusade call. Against Rohans Edoras, that is :-). And refrain from attacking Harad stacks which pass Erech as the easiest road of advance. Rohan AI receives a garrison script as well and will absorb enormous amounts of enemy troops before Edoras is conquered. If you spot more than 2 enemy stacks arriving more or less the same turn, position a small force next to Edoras to help out. It really helps autocalc in Rohans favour for reasons I never fully understood :-).
Tactical tips
Gondors main strength is its strong militia. And its key for winning battles is a mix of militia archers on fire and militia cavalry/Generals bodyguards. Most battles will be won by just harrassing the approaching enemy constantly with fire arrows, charge cavalry in (and immediately out again), distract full Mordor stacks letting them chase cavalry and commit infantry only when absolutely necessary.
Gondor has counters to Mumakils and Trolls on militia level. First one - Pelargir Marines, second one - Axemen of Lossarnach supported by archers. Conclusion? Build them early (and enough) to gain experience, although the travel time to reinforce damaged units may be a real pain.
As long as you have (how exhausted ever) militia archers still with arrows AND at least one unit of cavalry/General (if badly damaged) on the battlefield never regard a battle as lost. I won (to my complete surprise) battles deep in Mordor after 2/3rd of my units routed or were destroyed (damned trolls) by just exhausting the Mordor units chasing my archers and using the remaining cavalry sparsely for charges into diminished units. The key in those battles is the skirmishing mode for archers!
Against Mordor early you can take on odds up to 2:5 as long as you have sufficient archers and cavalry. BUT you MUST conduct each battle yourself. Depending on your skill the only exception is siege attacks if you (as me) suck at it - when your forces are superior autocalc may provide better results. Against Harad early the same applies (with the same force composition), you may even accept worse odds. Against Mordor late full stacks (including between 2 and 5 troll units) a full Gondor stack (with some professionals in) can still take on a battle confident to win.
Due to my experience the Harad AI switches from Corsars (light infantry) to spearmen accompanied by ballistas around the time you won the fifth battle against it. If by accident or to counter your battle winner (cavalry!) does not matter - things get EASIER afterwards as spearmen are a much worse counter to archer militia and the ballistas (mostly left alone) are easy prey for cavalry.
Trolls can be pretty easy prey IF you manage to pin them down (sacrifice a militia infantry) and either use Gondor archers (without fire turned on) or Axemen to kill them. Arrows ARE efective against trolls (remember - they ignore defence skill, which is the bulk of Trolls defence rating), if you harrass them some time they might all be still alive but after engaging infantry will suddenly unexpectedly start dying fast.
Siege defence with TW rules is really a pain in the ass, only preferred to field battles against cavalry heavy armies actually. Here comes why:
Archers - which should be the most effective def unit - fire high in the air because they miss a line of sight from the walls. They waste ammo on fire at will against already thinned out units far away. Some figures of units retreating into defence layers get stuck at gates and thus leave them open for the enemy. After units have passed (completely) gates stay open for no apparent reason. And so forth. So the only rules of thumb I found working are:
- Put most archers on fire (to save ammo), place them on walls only behind infantry (you can remove the infantry later) so at least the first line realizes it HAS a line of sight. Watch for the first salvos - if they only hit from above nigh vertical stop firing at that target and look for a better one
- Shoot from inside walls (or opposite walls in fortresses) against enemies fighting (or just standing idle) ON these walls. Retreat early into next defence layer (in fortresses and citadels that is) but as long as possible (including death of the unit) keep one unit above the gateway for the burning oil and the towers firing. Use catapults ONLY in between 2 defence layers OR on city plazas to ONLY shoot straight along streets where the enemy is channeled and forced to advance
- Use the mobility of cavalry to harrass already scattered armies after they are breaking the walls, to chase away the usual lone siege equipment unit advancing your gate waaaay before the main army etc. DON´T get them caught in prolonged melee, no matter the situation
- Always ensure that at least one unit is alive and guarding the gateway of the last defence layer - if you´re not good at siege defence use one unit from the start of battle
- Sally against a besieging force especially if you are heavy on archers and the enemy is heavy on infantry (and does NOT have trolls). Exploit the AI stupidity to ignore archers advancing from one side firing along the line and just answer with available archers (if and as long as available)
- Always establish the battle timer. Otherwise a standoff situation in sieges (the enemy can´t enter the next defence layer but your archers are out of ammo and your forces overall to week to chase the invader away) can NOT be ended and exiting in this situation you will lose (battle and town) regardless of loss ratio before
Taking all that into account you can still take on odds of 1:3 and WIN or odds worse and still manage to hold the fortress.
There is a bridge northwest of Hennen Amun. This bridge is the only entry point into Ithilien on the east side of the Anduin from the north. It defends Hennen Amun AND Cair Andros reliably from any incursion. Settle an army (archer heavy) on that bridge. Deal with any approaching army in the same fashion: Put all archers to your left in a position to fire into a crowd on the bridge (they will fire into the shieldless right side of any unit thus ensuring a high shot/kill ratio). Force enemy units to crowd on the bridge by pushing a sturdy unit (militia infantry if nothing else available) a bit into the bridge from your side. Have one infantry unit directly behind and minimum one cavalry for last minute pushes and mop up. Pair with a General directly behind infantry to prevent early routs. And enjoy the kill show :-). You can secure the complete northern Gondorian border with just between 7 to 10 units for a long time with this setup, if you circle and replenish units with Cair Andros and Hennen Amun if repeatedly attacked (you´re most likely not - Mordor will waste its armies against Minas Ithil instead).
The fort into Mordor just behind Minas Morgul (Ithil) can buy you a turn or two for reinforcements if just held by the most badly damaged unit. An enemy MUST conquer it before it can advance on Minas Ithil. As you sacrifice one unit this way, only do it in real emergency cases.
There is a ridge just southeast of the Black Gate citadel. If you managed to conquer Black Gate but for a reason or another reinforcements are far away (like you have to get them in from Cair Andros, which is a march of 4+ turns) settle on exactly this ridge leaning close to the mountains to the west. As a defender the terrain is so steep and rough that you may fight defensive battles with minimal losses against ANY odds. I once acheived a heroic victory with a partly damaged 2/3rd stack (mostly militia, including 2 catapults though) against no less than 2 full Mordor stacks including 5 troll units and did not lose more than 200 men in the fight (Mountains. I like them).
Against Mordor always (always) siege with less units than inside the target, but archer heavy. The enemy WILL sally the same turn you started the siege. Great. So you have a number of mindlessly storming units channeled by a small opening running into heavy archer fire arrows and repeatedly charged by cavalry :-). Result - an easy win without a real siege battle and with minimal losses (example: 2,500 Orcs against 1,000 Gondorians, Orcs 0 and Gondorians 750 at battle conclusion). In these cases end the battle as soon as you get the question to end or continue. The same rules apply as for an actual siege - you win the battle means the enemy is exterminated. Use the same setup against bandit towns for similar results.
Gondors unit selection:
1) Useful
All Militia (especially cavalry militia), Pelargir Marines (only against Mumakils, else slightly worse than infantry militia), Axemen of Lossarnach (good against trolls AND cavalry), Fountain Guards (late, your second reliable Troll killer), Gondor Infantry (as a longer surviving infantry militia replacement), Catapults (the BEST unit Gondor can field against high number Orc stacks which make extremely good targets for flaming ammunition).
2) Limited uses
Gondor archers (slower rate of fire with minimal more punch than militia archers, lack of shields limits their use as hybrid infantry, stakes rarely of any use except against late Harad armies). Gondor spearmen - you will not encounter enough cavalry to justify the build in numbers and against plain infantry they fare worse than sword infantry, the same (to my surprise) against Trolls. Citadel guards - only slightly better than spearmen but in shield wall able to pin down Trolls and survive.
3) Useless. Gondor cavalry (at availability actually worse than silver or gold chevron militia cavalry you should already have in numbers, needs investment in else useless stable upgrades). Ballista - you need a straight line of sight against a densely packed enemy unit. The moment you may have this (usually) the enemy is upon you. Build catapults instead. Swan knights mounted or dismounted - when you can build them you are most likely better off without (I received some for late missions only) as your frontline should be ages away. Ithilien rangers - again your frontline will be ages away and they only can be built and replenished in Ithilien and need an additional and otherwise useless investment in archer range upgrades. Trebuchets - price and investment (in siege workshops) too high for their range advantage over catapults.
In fact Gondors militia will be the bulk of your forces even at turn 150. For four reasons - they are just good enough even then, they are the first to be built or replenished in newly "acquired" cities, their alternate professional counterparts are not THAT much better and Gondor wins or loses the first 50 turns.
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.... that was even more crazy. but now i can counter both fairly well. one thing i will do different next game is try harder to capture Osgiliath and cair andros early. i didn't make that enough of a priority in my current game.
Defeating harad and mordor and stil help rohan vs isengard is a great challenge
!!
Originally Posted by ThorHa
