Curia Hostilia: Consulate of Marcellus/Caesar

[Winter]

I will not have a motion that is dependent upon the Consuls winning in a ridiculously short amount of time or being re-elected. It practially forces our hand. I for one am unconvinced that Carthage need be destroyed in its entirety anyway. As I have said, removing their rich Iberian provinces as well as the isles should cripple them and make them no more of a threat than the Illyrian pirates. Why should we waste lives and treasure on a foolhearted mission to Africa anyway?

[♔Jean-Luc Picard♔]

That seems a workable plan. Iberia shall become a Proconsulate regardless when we take it.

[M D]

"The plan is to take the Isles and Iberia so why do you not support the motion fellow tirbune?"

[The10thLegion]

I always support and bless this motion

[RVFVS]

I will not have a motion that is dependent upon the Consuls winning in a ridiculously short amount of time or being re-elected. It practially forces our hand. I for one am unconvinced that Carthage need be destroyed in its entirety anyway. As I have said, removing their rich Iberian provinces as well as the isles should cripple them and make them no more of a threat than the Illyrian pirates...

"Perhaps, but they are the one enemy that has always defied us and that has killed so many of our citizens. Surely the people of Rome demand that Carthage be destroyed. As long as they live they will be a banner our enemies may rally around."

[Xavier Dragnesi]

OOC: did anyone see my proposal of an added clause to the motion? It looks like everyone missed it at the end of the previous page.

[apple]

The tribune has raised many valued points. The motion needs to be rewritten!

OOC: Hence my 10th clause!!

Yes which means that we have to revote.

[Xavier Dragnesi]

OOC: Hence my 10th clause!!

[Winter]

"The plan is to take the Isles and Iberia so why do you not support the motion fellow tirbune?"

The motion currently being voted on has a foolish attack on Carthage herself included. This will cost many hundreds if not thousands of lives, and I would expect a fellow tribune to be concerned over that fact!

[Xavier Dragnesi]

"In light of the Tribune's words, I propose to rewrite my motion by deleting the phrase about capturing Africa and Carthage, and instead, leaving the legions in Iberia to defend it, and allow the Senate to discuss what to do about Carthage itself when the time comes."

[♔Jean-Luc Picard♔]

This is my suggestion on how the war ought to be carried out.

Senatus Consultum Bella Punica
1. The Consul Lucius Julius Caesar shall be granted one legion and imperium to recruit more cohorts to into a consular army to capture Corsica et Sardinia. His successor shall replace him should his term end before the Isles may be taken.
2. He shall also be granted a small fleet with which to transport his troops. These too shall be passed to his successor at the end of the term should the conquest be incomplete.
3. The Consul Marcus Claudius Marcellus shall be granted one legion and imperium to recruit more cohorts into a consular army to march west from Massilia. His successor shall replace him should his term end before the penninsula may be taken.
4. He is to march down the Iberian coast capturing major Carthaginian ports and economic areas.
5. When Consul Caesar or his successor is finished his taking of the Punic Isles, he is to sail for Iberia.
6. Together, both Consuls will destroy any other Carthaginian resistance on the peninsula
7. Upon the completion of these goals, one of the southern legions shall be given to an appointed Proconsul of Sicily for the island's defense. The other shall remain in Iberia to maintain peace under the appointed Proconsul of Iberia.

[RVFVS]

The motion currently being voted on has a foolish attack on Carthage herself included. This will cost many hundreds if not thousands of lives, and I would expect a fellow tribune to be concerned over that fact!

"War, tribune, ends lives. That is the point. Each commander tries to keep the other side from taking too many but it is inevitable that some will die. That is the sad fact but it is true."

Caesar shakes his head in anger.

[Xavier Dragnesi]

"I would edit it thus:

Senatus Consultum Bella Punica
1. The Consul Lucius Julius Caesar shall be granted one legion and imperium to recruit more cohorts to into a consular army to capture Corsica et Sardinia
2. He shall also be granted a small fleet with which to transport his troops.
3. The Consul Marcus Claudius Marcellus shall be granted one legion and imperium to recruit more cohorts into a consular army to march west from Massilia
4. He is to march down the Iberian coast capturing major Carthaginian ports and economic areas.
5. When Consul Caesar is finished his taking of the Punic Isles, he is to sail for Iberia.
6. Together, both Consuls will destroy any other Carthaginian resistance on the peninsula
7. The legions will be left in Iberia, to defend the land, and no further action will be taken on Africa.
8. The Senate will then discuss the matter of Carthage when the time comes.
9. For the purpose of defending Sicily, one of the southern legions shall be given to an appointed Proconsul
10. In the event that the campaign does not finish within a year, the Consuls shall retain command of their legions until the new Consuls arrive to take over them."

[The10thLegion]

I will be fighting in these battles, Lepidus, and Im not concerned, why should you? The plebs offering to join the army know the risks as well as the patricians. Of course people will die but not hundreds of thousands... i doubt more than 2,000 Romans will die. Cowerdness is not a virtue of a TRUE Roman.

[apple]

Not ether is stupidity. Cato spit.

[Ozy]

Nero, who had been half sleeping doring most of the debate, was woken up by the elevated tone of the voices of the Senators.

"I have to see this..." he thought, hoping for more tension to make things a little more interesting for him...

[M D]

"I do not want Carthage's mainland and homeland to be taken BUT I want the Isles and Iberia taken to cripple them, then we could negotiate diplomatically with them and woul dhave a very good bargaining chip..."

[♔Jean-Luc Picard♔]

A land once taken ought never be returned. I will oppose any motion to return land won by Roman might.

[Watercress]

'Not even if it saved one thousand lives?' says Vibius, turning around.

[Kingzilla]

I agree, we should attack no farther then Spain and the Punic Isle.