Help - Forest Battles - Offensive

[Nazgūl Killer]

I have no problem, at all, when fighting forest battles on the defensive, I escape with minor casualties because I hide my archers all around the forest (In two flanks of where I know the enemy will come from), protected by infantry and my cavalry hidden in edges of the forest, ready to flank, I put my general (Unhideable) in the place I want the foe to strike, and I place archers with stakes in front of him, in addition to pikemen/spearmen, it's just like shooting sitting ducks.

I am having an extreme problem, as of late, with forest battles in which I am the assailant... I usually win all my battles, I am good with those, but in forest battles... I'll compare:

Defensive Offensive
10% cavalry casualties. 50% cavalry casualties.
20/30% infantry casualties. 60/70% infantry casualties.
5/10% archer/artillery casualties. 10/20% archer/artillery casualties.
General dies only 1/15ths of the times, even that's rare. General dies 1/5th of the times!

(Statistics from 10 custom battles I did in forest terrain, completely even armies)
As you can see, I clearly have a problem. My best strategies don't work, and the AI easily flanks me! It utterly annoys me at times, I mean, sometimes I manage to escape with such a win that is worthy of gods, and sometimes I manage to escape with such a narrow win that is worthy of demons, and sometimes I get defeated so hard that I lose over half my army!
I need help, post your strategies for OFFENSIVE forest fighting, please.

[Viking Prince]

I hate to say this, but maybe you should be providing the hints. I suspect you do better than I in the forrest.

The only thing that I can suggest is to attack heavy on a flank and hope for the best in the chaos. I also try to watch for any broken units and immediately disengage from the pursuit. I just want to break the opposition and call it a quick victory. I am not concerned about capturing and running down with the cavalry. Too often the cavalry gets tied up with another unit and gets wasted, so I tend to only use the cavalry to break units on the flank and roll up the front.

[de Turenne]

Just noticed your post and thought i'd share my forest battle experiences...

If u have to fight a forest battle on the offensive my simple answer would be don't.
if u can avoid it any way, try to... for instance if there is an open plain next to the woodland move your troops there for optimum cavalry charges.
if fighting in dense forest is unavoidable,
a) let them come to you, even if you initiated the attack this may happen

or if u must attack them

b) don't let yourself get tied up in a struggle with the enemy infantry, use hit and run tactics with skirmishing troops such as javelins to skim numbers off the enemy and draw them into charging from their defensive position. this can be tricky with all the trees around, but if at a numerical disadvantage it is a better option then getting drawn into cramped infantry struggles with no hope of a decent cavalry charge.
With all units engaging one another in forest battles they can be highly costly as you say. So instead, pick lighter units and try some good old fashioned skirmishing tactics

[Nomadicjam]

I must admit forest battles are certainly a bane for me aswell. It really captures the sense of dread when you sit there thinking "What the hell is happening down there!" Although I agree with the idea of using massed skirmishers I find that never ties in with my overall campaign strategy. eg. Invading a region so I can besiege a city or castle.

This an extremely laborious tactic but I find if timed properly it works. It involves hiding a portion of your force at a right-angle to your main battle line and using that line to draw your enemy out into an ambush. It involves alot of marching up and down and your innitial deployment is crucial to second guessing where your enemy is going to be. So this tactic is hardly a sure fire winner. but it does reduce on casulties when it works.
Otherwise I use the steamroller method, If your attacking with superior numbers or superior quality troops (prefably both) application of your strongest point on the enemies weakest (But after reading your guides I hardly need to tell you that )

[Silent Assassin]

Forest battles on the offensive are quite hard, first your cavalry is useless in them, your formation is not accurate and you can't have a good charge.
Archers will take 8 volleys to kill the amont of men that you would in one when on open field same goes for artillery. Good infantry is probably your best bet but like a poster aboved said try to not do battles when on the offensive side

[Nazgūl Killer]

Well... I've tried the skirmishing strategy, doesn't work for me... I've tried many things until I stumbled upon the best strategy:
I sent up my archers in range of their lines of defense, and my infantry behind them, the archers shoot and the infantry wait. While at it, I sent my cavalry to the flank, now they keep getting hit until they had enough and they attack, when they reach too close to my archers, I send them back, hold fire and charge my infantry in, while doing that I form a C around their flanks with my cavalry and rush in, this strategy works perfectly;
I suffered only 20% infantry casualties, only 10% cavalry casualties, 5% archer/artillery casualties! It was insanely useful

[Muagan_ra]

The AI is typically not very savvy to ambushing tactics - so, I'd say you can reasonably expect a standard formation. Just advance, slowly, and proceed as normal - it works for me.

Maybe luring them out of position with exposed archers and skirmishers would be a good diea.

[Nazgūl Killer]

In forest battles they always go for my general, even if I have other troops not hidden. I use that to my advantage

[Muagan_ra]

Maybe you could just use cannon-fodder, a few peasant units, and run them toward the enemy position, that should both reveal and distract them.

[Nazgūl Killer]

Maybe you could just use cannon-fodder, a few peasant units, and run them toward the enemy position, that should both reveal and distract them.

I use archers for that, their general cannot be hidden, so I simply fire at the general, until they get sick of it and try to attack me

[Fakir]

Don't use a general and NEVER use missile units, heavy infantry, any type of cavalry or artillery. Also avoid using the following at all costs: light and/or javelin infantry, gunpowder units, spearmen, pikemen, halberdiers, axemen.

If you have access to camel cavalry, don't use them.

[Viking Prince]

Don't use a general and NEVER use missile units, heavy infantry, any type of cavalry or artillery. Also avoid using the following at all costs: light and/or javelin infantry, gunpowder units, spearmen, pikemen, halberdiers, axemen.

If you have access to camel cavalry, don't use them.

OK -- can you make this a bit simpler:

Suppose you are playing the HRE which is just filled with forrests for 'open' field combat. What would be your choice of units to deal with a French incursion around 1180? or 20 turns into the game if that is easier for you to answer?

Your list seems to have eliminated all units from the mix! And unless you want to greatly increase the chance of the friendlies turning rebel, you will be using a general.

[Nazgūl Killer]

Don't use a general and NEVER use missile units, heavy infantry, any type of cavalry or artillery. Also avoid using the following at all costs: light and/or javelin infantry, gunpowder units, spearmen, pikemen, halberdiers, axemen.

If you have access to camel cavalry, don't use them.

(THIS IS BY NO MEANS SUPPOSED TO OFFEND ANYONE! I AM SORRY IF IT DID)
Did you seriously just say that?
Don't use your general, wait for him to get flanked.
Don't EVER use missile units - Why? What sense is there in that? If they come up close I just make them run, I can micromanage.
Any type of cavalry or artillery? Are you serious? I mean come on. Artillery can NEVER be bad, just stop auto fire and aim at their general when they come too close, and don't use cavalry? That's a sure recepie to lose a fight.
Heavy infantry no? Are you serious? I'm not even going to bother with a reply.
Light infantry or javelin infantry is a no no? What makes you say that?
Gunpowder units, spear men pike men, halberds, axe men no? Are you bleeding serious?

Fakir, listen, don't advise other people if you don't know what you're talking about, because what you just said was "DON'T USE ANY UNIT! JUST WAIT UNTIL YOU LOSE!"

Your advice is completely senseless, no offense meant, at all, but I hope that people actually ignore this advice, because you just covered every single unit in the game (Aside ships) and told me not to use them.

[Fakir]

Your list seems to have eliminated all units from the mix!

Bingo!

In other words: DO NOT fight offensive forest battles.

[Nazgūl Killer]

Bingo!

In other words: DO NOT fight offensive forest battles.

Could've just said that

[Viking Prince]

So then the enemy just waits in the forrests until you present a weakness. Nope. If they are in the forests, you need to go in and defeat the enemy or you do not control your own regions. Use patience and take care. It is an interesting battle option to be enjoyed. How many battles do you enter that the victory is in doubt?

[Nazgūl Killer]

So then the enemy just waits in the forrests until you present a weakness. Nope. If they are in the forests, you need to go in and defeat the enemy or you do not control your own regions. Use patience and take care. It is an interesting battle option to be enjoyed. How many battles do you enter that the victory is in doubt?

I tend to fight in a way I give the AI a chance also.


Anyways, update, I have just gotten into a war with France (SS6.1, I'm with Spain), I took down Bordeaux and Angers and I'm moving through the forests, dozens, and yes, I mean DOZENS, of French armies waited in those forests! Pretty much the most amazing war I've ever had.
10 year war, I took West France and some of the middle of it, and I got pushed back to west (Thanks to those forests), after that, I gave the places I still had in France to Portugal in exchange for their African lands.

What I'm trying to say: FIGHT IN FRANCE! Massive forest battles = Happy happy people!

[Fakir]

All I can say is napalm.

[Nazgūl Killer]

All I can say is napalm.

[Viking Prince]

I tend to fight in a way I give the AI a chance also.

I never implied that I intentially give the AI a chance - though it is related to the way I fight.