3.4 XAI for PDER Bug and Balancing reporting

[Derfele]

Thanks for the info & link to the Bloodmod Pnutmaster
Appreciate it.

[Pnutmaster]

Taking xeryx's fatherly advice, I started a hotseat campaign (XAI 3.401) with medium difficulty CAI and a stricter money script (smaller increases to king's purse). I relinquished control to the AI, went out to the gym for an hour (athletic nerd ), and came back to a joyous sight!



England invaded Ireland and set up a manly Hadrian's Wall! (Three of those stacks are captain-led, but only because England's stretched far and lacking in family members/generals).



The rebels use forts! (speaking of which--I cannot wait for PDER 2.0's pre-placed forts).

Still curious, I toggled the fog of war...





The AI expansion and apparent use of naval invasions make me smile (note: Egypt controls Rhodes and Sardinia; Seljuks control Cyprus and are allied with the Turks; the larger factions have more general-led than captain-led stacks; considering Sicily lacks a settlement with a stone wall, my money script probably has not fired--explaining why Scotland was stunted and overpowered by England).

[xeryx]

Thanks Pnut .. I am new to using the hotseat myself. I have always ran campaigns myself. Which I still maintain you need to try and do if you have time.

What I have really like about the Auto campaign, is that it give you a way to see if there is randomness, which there was always. The fqactions will primarily expand it's borders..but wil naval invade. That is especially nice for Sicily! Them and the HRE are the Dark forces of the Catholics, be very wary of them.

Nice Screen shots too. Now I have notice some variations from the original, XAI files keep track of them, so we make sure reporting is accurate.

Speaking of reporting.
I do not mind constructive feedback guys. I just want you to "think" before you post.maybe you might come up with the next great idea.

I have been doing some battles with cavalry. I am going to change the masses for the horses. They are too devastating, and unrealistic IMHO.

[Hunter_PT]

Hi guys, for sure something is wrong with the CAI vs human vh/vh the ai most of the time prefers to atack the rebels and other factions than me, and for ex: Hre was sieging two of my settlements and in the other turn they left the siege see picture, the french army did the same thing in paris see picture.
The French and HRE are beeter than me in game they have more armies.

One strange thing that i noticed, the faction of sicily and Venice are at war in one turn and in the other they are not, they are like this for several turns now with good armies near anemy settlements and dont atack.

one more thing French and HRE are REASONOBLE towards me, this is crazy becouse im at war with Hre for ages.

I did a fresh install of PDER and patched to 1.0a then i copy paste all your 3.4 PDER XAI files to PODER files i hope i did it right, i didnt install it.
Remenber Xeryx i removed the money scripts and garrison scripts too see how well the Cai was doing, i hope i didt messed with the ai files

Here is my campaign script plz take a look.

[xeryx]

No problem, i will take a look at it. I probably need to change the human specific commands should be an easy fix

[Hunter_PT]

Hi Xeryx, are you going to put the fix files on this forum for testing or i have to go to your banner to download?

[xeryx]

I took this weekend off, since twc was down. I have some other things I want to look at as well. It maybe a week or so. But they will definitely be in at the Filefront, then I will try and update more stuff, It is just riduculous ..I need more help!! (and a no wise cracks on that one)

Oh yeah I fixed the AI levels, for diplomacy, Alliances are going to be scarcer on the harder levels. We'll try this instead, because the help your ally rules work so well. To much flip flopping of alliances, geeze.

[Derfele]

Some updates from me…


I saw CAI in action!
- played PDER without XAI, then installed XAI & did the same attack –
Playing Scotland, first turn nip down to Lancaster Castle from Dun Phris and attack.
Anyway with the XAI in, the English sent 2 forces to support their town under siege from York & Nottingham!
So that was pretty cool. Without the XAI England did nothing about my overt overtones of war.


On Alliances
I wasn't refused any -- but I didn't try with my neighbors because it means I have to break them later -- see my earlier post on establishing alliance blocks. But very easy to get the ones I asked for.


On PDER
The Settlements in Ireland don’t seem to have Titles, like Lord of Genoa (Doge di Genova) or wherever.
Settlements are: Tuaim, Corcaigh & Baile Atha Claith in Ireland, though Baile Atha Claith does give “King of Ireland” if you take the settlement. Searched the ancillaries list for these settlements to check, but they may be called something different in the file?
For example in Scotland, Dun Phris on the Campaign (in-game) Map is called Dumfries in the ancillary file.



Knights of Light….
Ok, playing Genoa on vh/vh, something weird is happening with the textures of my General.
It is turn 3, so this is a general that I started the game with, not a family member.
Checkout his bodyguard, the “Knights of light”


The problem unit is the 3rd dude with 11 men, note – his textures are fine, it is just his men….


Comparison with normal bodyguard of a family member

Any ideas as to what the story is?

[Derfele]

Knights of Light Update:
I now have built a different General (non-family member). He & his bodyguard appear fine.

The original Knight of Light still appears, well his bodyguard do as the Knights of Light....
Blighter is a rebel though...I got him to hold the Heir Futurus. While it doesn't say that it adds Authority, it does and I think that had a very bad effect on this general, who couldn't become King - not a family member. So I can't leave him "unguarded" now.

Quite dispicable since his body guard are the "Knights of Light"...


On PDER
Heir Futurus has a spelling mistake in it's description.
" +1 Loyalt " instead of Loyalty -- unless this is an ancient spelling?, or is meant for adding to the flavour to the game


cheers,
Derf

[Pnutmaster]

Settlements are: Tuaim, Corcaigh & Baile Atha Claith in Ireland, though Baile Atha Claith does give “King of Ireland” if you take the settlement. Searched the ancillaries list for these settlements to check, but they may be called something

I checked the original PDER 1.0a files and it appears those settlements never had titles. The rationale, if I recall, was that these towns barely existed until the Norman invasion of Ireland.

Heir Futurus has a spelling mistake in it's description.
" +1 Loyalt " instead of Loyalty -- unless this is an ancient spelling?, or is meant for adding to the flavour to the game

Haha, that's odd. I don't have the same error in my game, but I have seen descriptions cut off before. If you don't mind getting your hands dirty, go into the PDER 1.0a/data/text folder, open the document export_ancillaries and overwrite the "Heir Futurus" entry with this...(making sure to preserve all of the spacing and syntax).

{heir_orb} Heir Futurus
{heir_orb_desc} The holder of this promise is in line to inherit the throne of your Kingdom.
{heir_orb_effects_desc} +1 Loyalty

[Derfele]

Thanks Pnutmaster for the info.
No worries, I can change it - weird that it is cut-off for me...

I also have some questions re: recruiting & free-upkeep units, but will post later when I have more time...

Cheers,
Derf

[Derfele]

Greetings all,

I had my first semi-major battle in PDER, and I had the fight of my TW life!
So, I thought I would fill you in


I was besieging a minor city with 11 units (getting a head-start on building siege equipment essentially) while bringing up 4 more units for the actual attack.

Low & behold, I was sallied against!
Well, that just stunned me -- was I playing too complacently, just assuming they would let me build siege gear under their noses?
YEP !


Out they came!
I have never been sallied against before
It gave me quite a trill, and just a TAD of panic...
I lost the initial 5-10 seconds of the battle while I watched them streaming out.
It was really professional, cavalry to the flanks, spearmen backing up missile units. In under 30 sec I was receiving incoming fire! WOW.


Anyways, that snapped me into action...but I didn't know what to do, it was like they grabbed the initiative and held it...
I prepared my line just in time to meet the on-rush of enemy troops...

They had superior numbers, and flanked easily.
I was hoping the line would hold and looking around for their cav (Mailed Knights) -- where did they get to?
Then they came…charging out of the blue & pinned 2 of my General's cav, they were also rushing extra spearmen to carve them up while pinned.
None of my infantry could give support as they were flanked and fully engaged...and dying horribly...


I tried to extract my General Cav asap, but the spearmen were on me & it was messy…
The enemy cav charged after my retreat, and as you know, if being chased by cav, they cull your slowest...
I had one full strength General left and charged in, combining my 3 General cav to beat their 2 mailed knights off, once I had run far enough from their chasing spearmen.
But the damage was done -- 2x Generals now down to like 1/3 strength, not good for much now...
My rescuing General was very much intact though.


Hang on…where did that enemy General get to?
Dang, he is filleting my archers!
He had raced around and doubled back, charging my archers at the rear!
Well, the archer covering fire was the only thing left bolstering my line.
You know what is coming next?


The unthinkable happened -- my line broke - within 10 sec, I had all my line infantry & archers fleeing for their lives

MAN!
In all my time playing MTW, in a proper battle I have NEVER had ALL my line units break...
It was so much fun


It was a “to the death battle”, so I thought I may as well take out as many as I could…
I only have 3 General Cav left, 1 full strength, the other at about 1/3, first, let’s deal with the enemy General’s Cav – who at present is culling my routing archers.

Charged in with all 3 of my Cav, blowing the rally horn!
1 of my spearmen units headed the call & rushed in to help.
We got rid of that pest (enemy General, and the last of the enemy cav).

Then spearmen were closing on us, my spearmen routed again, but at least they helped dispatch the General.


Ok, no enemy cav to pin me now, most of the enemy chasing my routing units…let’s find some tasty archers…


So found them I did!
They were far away from help at the time because of my fleeing men & the enemy infantry chasing them down. The 2 units I picked on broke quickly, and then my chance came to snatch VICTORY from defeat!

I followed them into the town square, cutting them down quickly and starting the count-down timer…
3 mins to go…


The enemy away chasing my routing units were near the edge of the map and exhausted form all their chasing & killing. I left my weakest cav to hold town square and charged out with the other 2.
Charge, retreat quickly, rinse & repeat. Not trying to do heaps of damage, just stay alive & slow them down… Don’t want any to get to Town Square….


It was coming down to the wire…
The enemy was coming back in separated, but the first units, though slowed were not engaging me and instead heading for the gates. Time for a last effort pitch battle to stop them getting through.
So I committed.


My General second in command was badly mauled, just him & 1 body guard left, raced him to town square for a “hand-over” with the 3rd General. Left my main General who was the full strength, to hold them himself. Raced my 3rd General into help, cutting down the last of the now broken enemy unit 50meters before town square, but there was another enemy unit almost at the gates…

Charged in again.
It was literally all, or nothing.
Well, at least in my case…I might get out with a handful of routed troops and hopefully 1 General left, but having captured the City!


3rd general routed, with only himself making it clear, my main General then fell, but his remaining bodyguard kept fighting. The enemy now had broken through the gates and were streaming unhindered towards town square, my defence now shattered…


But hope was with me as my remaining 2nd General and his 1 remaining trusty bodyguard held there ground at the edge of town square.
*At this point I wasn’t sure what the heck to do, because if I charge, I loose control of town square, but I don’t have enough men to keep some in there, and I can’t let the enemy set a foot in the square either!*


And then hope was fulfilled!
The timer ran dry! Just with the enemy so close!


A VICTORY, but what a cost…
In my stupid jubilation…I forgot to screenshot DANG!
I have a screenshot for the battle beginning, but not that first ending…

However, it was so much fun, I reloaded my endturn save, ended my turn & waited for them to sally, and played it another 6 times.

Of the next 5 tries I lost each time…hehe


I tried many different things including retreating my line troops to a small hill top near the edge of the map – no not a corner I didn’t use the edge to protect my flanks.


Then I pulled off a Heroic Victory!
Not sure exactly how. It was hectic as anything, my timing was impeccable which helped, sometimes just a split second in it with some cav manoeuvrers. Was certainly helped by some poor luck on the enemy’s side.
I remembered to take a screen of that one


I would usually not re-play a battle – iron man rule, but this one was so much fun, I had to experience it over & over again.


I made the silly mistake of saving over my first victory, but was happy enough to continue the game with my 6th try & only other victory.


Thank you Xeryx and anyone else who helped you put this XAI marvel together

[xeryx]

That sounded great Deferle, Sorry guys, I am out for a few days work emergency, you will all have to help and rep each other.

[Derfele]

Hope you get it under control mate.
Talk when you are back.

Cheers,
Derf.

[Derfele]

Some updates from me…

Genova on vh/vh -- continued --

XBAI:

The battles continue to be excellent.
My losses are higher, and a few times I really thought I was going to lose a battle, especially taking a Castle, even with a full stack. Guile and Trickery is what saved the day for me. Haven’t had to rely on those skills to tip the balance before…
I am even choosing to sacrifice units with diversionary attacks, because the XBAI tracks you much more closely, and isn’t easily fooled.

Eg:
Attacking a Castle – stone, first upgrade from wooden castle:
I was simply going to attack with 4 siege towers (no ballista equipment), pincer & surround the defenders on the wall, they would route.
Part of the wall would now be effectively mine.
Make a protected base on the wall for my archers and crossbows to rain fire down while my infantry made a perimeter below.

Set this up near town square, because then my archers can rain fire down on them.
They would be forced to attack my nasty defensive perimeter of rested troops below.
The enemy would then route back to town square, under missile fire all the way.

Hehe…– so in the bag baby!
I have won so many times this way!



Or so I thought…

I got beaten badly…
My troops made the walls, and even with reinforcements were beaten back.
It was me routing on the walls because the XBAI kept reinforcing it’s position, and didn’t give an inch… I was the one pincered.



Hmmm…again, treating this XBAI to flippantly…
So, I needed to play to my advantage more.
The enemy had superior troops, but I had greater numbers.

I had to engage them more widely, I couldn’t afford these 1:1 confrontations now that the XAI was reinforcing it’s men on the walls. Remember I was trying to pincer them on the walls & so invoke a 2:1 attack in my favour, which clearly now I was unable to do.


Thus:
I re-loaded and made some ladders too, and left a few lurkers in trees close to the Castle.

Attack went ahead with the 4 siege towers again, doing dummy runs, then concentrating quickly. Trying to pincer them again and concentrate the enemy on this side of the castle.


The enemy still left troops on the walls covering my ladder men – one was seen, but the other hidden.

Timing was everything…

I raced in with the two sets of ladders, one drawing the troops on the wall away from the gates…
The other group I delayed slightly, to make sure the bait was taken, then I rushed in closer to the gates.
As soon as these troops were up, they ran to secure the gates.
I had the timing with my other groups (Cav + my best Infantry) to charge the gates, hitting them just after I captured them.
So I was in with 3x General’s Cav.
Now some pitch fighting to hold the gates, as the enemy tried to re-take them.

I decided to leave my siege tower men on the walls knowing they were tying up valuable enemy troops.
Knowing they were not going to win.
I was soon in with 5x good infantry.
Now I had my bridge-head.
Cav had suffered, all down to under 5 men each.
After Battle, I found one General (via Traits) was Severely Wounded, another had too many friends die and his heart was no longer in battles…


I moved my bridgehead around the walls of the Castle, trying to relieve the men I had on the walls.
I was not very successful in saving them, but I was able to pin and eliminate the enemy’s missile troops and some of the other units that had decimated my siege tower men.

However, now I had my space on the wall near town square with a dangerous corridor “V” formation to beat back any attacks.
I brought up my missile troops to the wall and “went to town” on town square.


It wasn’t quite the end…
The XBAI used it’s remaining Cav to harass my low protected flank of my “V” Formation. I had my weakened Cav, with 3 units of militia spearmen to hold them. It was touch and go, I took 80% losses on my spearmen, but the line held…just.


So, they day was won…sort of.
Castle taken, but 500+ men lost to around 350 enemy (– I play with small unit size.)
And that was my second try, after badly losing the first.

Bravo! Very pleased with how hard it was.




XCAI:
Now I am playing very aggressively.
Really taking as many rebel settlements as possible quickly.

However I am quite stretched (not at war with anyone, but have some alliances), and up comes this diplomat from Reino d’Arago (North-East Spain) and demands money in exchange for not attacking me!

For the first time I had a twinge of “Diplomatic Fear”.
I have NEVER been asked for money before, but looking at my position and his armies…it was an excellent political move by Reino d’Arago.

I had to buy them off…the cheek of it all!
Now I bet they are making more armies to come and get me with…

I just wasn’t expecting that…


World Development:
What is happening in the world?

Here is turn 1



Compare Turn 15


Reino de Castilla (Spain),
Rioghachd na h-Alba (Scotland),
Serenissima Repubblica di Venezia (Venice),
Kongeriget Danmark (Denmark)
have all used Naval Invasions to secure 1-2 territories.

As you can see, most Nations have expanded by 1-3 territories.
Not many waring Nations yet, the ones being:
Cilician Armenia (Armenians south-east Turkey) at war with Anadola Selcuklulari (Turkey) & Buyuk Selcuklu Deveti (Antioch / Jerusalem area)
+
Buyuk Selcuklu Deveti (Antioch / Jerusalem area) at war with al-Fatimiyyun Khilafah (Egypt)


There are quite a few full stack armies on the move, so things should spice up nicely in the next 5-10 turns.
All in all, it seems pretty good.



PDER Specific:

1) AOR
Is there any explanation of how AOR works? I did hear rumours of a pdf somewhere…
I only just found out that I need a Governor to build military buildings.
Some things don’t make sense though –again, mostly because I don’t know how they work.

For Example:
I am playing Genova, I start with 2 minor cities – Genova & Milano.
Considering Milano ---
It already has:
Imperial Auxiliary Barracks (Northern European)
Auxiliary Stables (Northern European)

I can’t build any units there, even though it is 1 of only 2 starting cities for me.
Plus, though it has Stone Walls (5 units upkeep free), no units I build at Genova – the other minor city will garrison free there.
They do garrison-free in Genova, including Generals.


Again, I assume this is because of AOR – I am not Northern European I would speculate (I don’t know what I am)
I guess I will have to:
1) Destroy the Imperial Auxiliary Barracks (North European) & Auxiliary Stables (Northern European)
2) Build a Milanese Auxiliary Hall
3) Continue to build barracks type
Is this correct?
Or if I build a Milanese Auxiliary Hall, will I then be able to use the Imperial Auxiliary Barracks (North European) & Auxiliary Stables (Northern European)?
It just seems illogical that in a starting city I have to destroy 2 buildings and build new ones before I can recruit any units.


Interestingly:
I have captured Cagliari (Wooden Castle).
It has a Sicilian Auxiliary Barracks (Southern European).
I can recruit Peasants and Levy Spearmen there.
Does this mean I am Southern European?
However, I still don’t get any free upkeep of units…perhaps I need Castle-Specific units for free upkeep in a Castle?



Where is my GOLD ?
Or – why can’t I cross the desert?

My Merchant has painstakingly hoofed it down to the gold, after all, coin is tight on Genova -- only to find it was “end of rainbow” type gold…
Is it meant to be that way?
A resource that you can’t use because you can't get to it?


Now from here I can’t cross the desert to the sea, my only option is north again…
Is this the way it is meant to be?


Any ideas & info very appreciated.

Cheers,
Derf.

[Derfele]

Hmmm...no comments?
What about the Gold?

Anyways, I'm away for a couple of weeks -- may have internet, may not.
Shall make more reports as the need arises.

cheers,
Derf.

[Hunter_PT]

Hi Xeryx, is the passive Cai against human player fixed in PDER? If it is wich file i need to donwload? Thanks.

[Hamenaglar]

I too would like to report that BAI in non-siege battles seems a bit too aggressive. They really don't have to attack me uphill every time, sometimes (if they are the defenders) they could just pick their ground and wait for me. Otherwise, the battles are really challenging. I've already lost two of my generals when assaulting small towns (still I managed to win barely both times).

[Hunter_PT]

Hi Hamenagler, dont forget if your army has archers and the enemy army have less or none they have to atack you, if they dont atack, they will lose 1/3 of their armie by your arrows.
Im telling you this becouse some times i atack with only infantry, and the enemy stay put and chose the high ground to defend. I hope this helps.

[xeryx]

Hi Xeryx, is the passive Cai against human player fixed in PDER? If it is wich file i need to donwload? Thanks.

What are you talking about?