Russia violates Finnish Air Space

[wilpuri]

PM Vanhanen to protest violations of Finnish air space by Russian war planes
Encroachments take place over Gulf of Finland

* Russian Air Force planes have violated Finnish air space while flying over the Gulf of Finland about 20 times in the past year.
* * * The Ministry for Foreign Affairs has spoken about the encroachments with Russia’s Ambassador to Finland, Vladimir Grinin. The matter has also been discussed with the Russian military attaché. However, the violations have continued in spite of Finnish demands that they stop.
* * * The Finnish government has agreed that if the violations continue, Finland would take the issue to the highest political level, when Prime Minister Matti Vanhanen (Centre) meets Russian Prime Minister Mikhail Fradkov in Moscow in early June.
* * *
News of the repeated violations was made public on Thursday on a news broadcast on the commercial television network MTV3. Immediately after the broadcast, the Ministry for Foreign Affairs issued a brief statement confirming the story.
* * * According to the Foreign Ministry’s statement, the issue has been discussed with President Tarja Halonen and the government’s committee on foreign and security policy.
* * * Russian military planes have also repeatedly violated Estonian air space, prompting immediate protests. The Finnish Foreign Ministry opted for silent diplomacy, but the violations have continued.
* * * The encroachments into Finnish air space have taken place over the Gulf of Finland between Porvoo and Hanko. The planes in question have been flying between St. Petersburg and Kaliningrad. Finnish Air Force fighters were sent* to identify the Russian planes, which promptly left Finnish air space.
* * *
The precise reasons why the Russian planes have deviated into Finnish air space are not known. Possible explanations include the increase in air traffic, indifference, and poor communications.
* * * The air corridor over the Gulf of Finland is somewhat narrow, but jet fighters should be able to stay within it.
* * * The Swedish-language newspaper Hufvudstadsbladet reported today that the Finnish government sees the repeated violations as a deliberate provocation. According to well-placed sources interviewed by the newspaper, Russia could be testing how Finland, and possibly the EU and NATO, will react.

http://www.helsinginsanomat.fi/engli.../1101979596885

[Spetsnaz]

Come on,if the USA would violate your air space you would just sit silent. :rolleyes

[DEMETRIOUS II]

Now you know how us Greeks feel with Turkeys constant air space violations on a monthly/weekly basis over the Aegean. 20 times? Ha that's nothing try doubling ot tripleing that.

[Tiwaz]

Originally posted by Spetsnaz@May 20 2005, 09:07 AM
Come on,if the USA would violate your air space you would just sit silent. :rolleyes

So?

I honestly doubt it though. Guess you haven't heard but Finns are one of the most negative feeling nations regarding USA AND Russia.

Next time foreign planes crosses our territory we should just force it to land, confiscate it and after interrogation of crew put them in prison for espionage.

[The-Great-Dane]

Originally posted by Spetsnaz@May 20 2005, 08:07 AM
Come on,if the USA would violate your air space you would just sit silent. :rolleyes

Defenetily not!
The Americans have violated the Danish Air Space up to twenty times over the last 5 years. Not with military planes, but planes carrying prisoners to country's, who accpet torture. It is right now a big case in the media in Denmark.
So it is defenetily wrong to say anything like that.
Sorry for being off-topic. Just wanted to say this!

Why would Russia do anything like this? Hmm, don't understand it. You should shoot those bugs down.

[MadBurgerMaker]

Originally posted by The-Great-Dane@May 20 2005, 06:17 AM
Why would Russia do anything like this? Hmm, don't understand it. You should shoot those bugs down.

I dont understand why Russia would want to start messing with Finland like this, but Im also not so sure Finland wants to do anything that might start another war with them.


On a side note...you guys are obsessed with the United States, it seems. Kinda strange.

[wilpuri]

Heh, I say let's join NATO. Right back at ya!

[ngr]

No wonder! It's not because Russia want another war with Finland and reconnoiter the current situation. It's just because Russian airplanes has no any navigation systems. You know it's very hard to understand where you are when you're flying over the sea.

[wilpuri]

Heh, the Russians are denying all accusations. Our Foreign Minister says our evidence of it occuring is quite clear. :huh

[Spetsnaz]

Willpuri,calm down,we russians like finns cause you are europeans,and our friends,We DONT want to envade your country,dont worry,we have other problems :those chiniese,and America,so its just a stupidity of our pilots or locators *wink*

[Sulla]

I think,

Russia could be testing how Finland, and possibly the EU and NATO, will react.

sums it up quite well.

These things are never an accident. They are seeing what they can get away with and testing the resove of other countries to react. Will be interesting to see how this develops.

[wilpuri]

Some instances are likely to have been accidents or simply indifference, but with the equipment in some of the planes it should not be unclear where you are flying.

[Tiwaz]

Originally posted by TranceCrusader@May 20 2005, 10:39 AM
They were probably drunk and taking their girlfriends for an air ride, relax, they were just trying to get layed.

Well, I think finnish pilot would get really good luck with ladies if he put a missile to one Antonov which was over Finland... You know, relax. You got plenty of people and planes so what if few are shot down. At least our pilots would get lucky.

[Hanno the Navigator]

Originally posted by Sulla@May 20 2005, 09:28 AM
These things are never an accident. They are seeing what they can get away with and testing the resove of other countries to react. Will be interesting to see how this develops.

Yup, but most probably, some foreign ministry folks will trade angry notes and that's that. This stuff happens constantly all over the world, though in most cases, it's simply a pilot taking a quick 'snap' over the border. The purpose is to keep MoD data on air defense doctrine current, or maybe some lametta bearer wants to impress his superiors and advance his career. In this case, judging from the umber of intrusions, there seems to be some guy on the ground ordering it, but whether it is simply a commander wanting to appear sharp and gung-ho or some MoD personnel cannot be determined. US pilots OTOH, when intruding into foreign airspace or otherwise violating flight regulations seem to be doing it on their own decision, because they feel like it or because the amphetamines make them twitchy *wink*.

Usually the country whose aircraft violated regulations will apologize, claim to be looking into the matter and then behind everyone's backs congratulate the pilot or commander for their guts and initiative.

(Of course the Russians have plans for a war against Finland in the drawer. Just as every major power, possibly even including certain Euro countries, havs contingency plans for fightingeach other. In a time where most major military forces are simply sitting around doing not much in particular, or at least nothing different from the same-old same-old, the MoDs' paper pushers need some justification for their pay... and what better justification than to argue that these what-if plans are in need of updating? This will keep thousands of cushionfarts well fed and clothed for another half year at least :grin All this brouhaha about the US supposedly planning to start a war against Iran in early June is based on exactly such contingency planning: it does not mean that they will start this war, but that, if they found it necessary to do so for whatever reason, they have at least up-to-date target lists, C3I structures etc. Given Dubya's recent public admission that Iraq was a major cock-up in all significant areas EXCEPT the actual fighting of the Iraqi army proper, expect a smattering of 'the US is going to attack that-and-that country soon!' reports later this year *tongue* )

[Portuguese Rebel]

so its just a stupidity of our pilots or locators

Somehow i find that really hard to believe. Those violations are probably deliberate. They are probably just probing and messing with Finns. *tongue*

[wilpuri]

According to well-placed sources interviewed by the newspaper, Russia could be testing how Finland, and possibly the EU and NATO, will react.

Some military figures have also been speculating on this.

[Portuguese Rebel]

According to well-placed sources interviewed by the newspaper, Russia could be testing how Finland, and possibly the EU and NATO, will react.

Do you Finns have some AA missiles? :whistle
Now, seriously, this is exactly it. They are testing defenses. The military personel of the entire world do this sort of crap all the time. A while ago the spanish sent a squadron of fighters to a portuguese island violating air space. They stoped when the radars of the island targeted them and a radio message was sent questioning about their presence. It's just wargames out of boredom of the inactive european military.

[DEMETRIOUS II]

I believe that they are testing new aircraft equipment and anti detection devices. I think the Russians should try and violate Chinese airspace and leave the peace loving Fins alone you pussies. The Chinese will probably shoot them down within minutes just like they shot the American spy plane a few years ago.

[Spetsnaz]

The Chinese will probably shoot them down

Then we will nuke China. :grin

[ajimenez3]

Originally posted by DEMETRIOUS II@May 20 2005, 02:13 PM
I believe that they are testing new aircraft equipment and anti detection devices. I think the Russians should try and violate Chinese airspace and leave the peace loving Fins alone you pussies. The Chinese will probably shoot them down within minutes just like they shot the American spy plane a few years ago.

Are you kidding? Who would they sell their Military equipment to then? :lol


Semper Fi