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Thread: keep EB2 flexible

  1. #1

    Default keep EB2 flexible

    It is a wunderfull idea how the creators of the Total War serie are keeping the game free for individual modifications and adaptations and buying a game you buy a serie of games covering different eras and needs.
    Let us keep this idea open.
    Make EB2 the best mod not only with your work but with you open mind.
    Dear EB2 team. Please don't use all sockets until the last hard coded limits. Don't be greedy. Let for example 1-2 fraction and 3-4 unit places free. And may be other sockets also because if you use 255 or 252 from something it will be not a great difference for you. This way submodder of EB2 will have easyer work.
    What I like by RTR not just the basic mod but the good submods available.
    I have myself also created a couple of submods but only for my own needs without publicating them and I am a programmer. I have also created a couple of games and game concepts so I know what I am speaking.

    thanks

  2. #2
    delra's Avatar Praepositus
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    Default Re: keep EB2 flexible

    Show us those submods.

  3. #3
    eggthief's Avatar Praepositus
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    Default Re: keep EB2 flexible

    Who needs submods for EB2? Sure there are slight gameplay changing 'mods' like the city mod but I doubt that submods like these clash a lot with the original EB. Just think before you start proposing amazing ideas again.

  4. #4

    Default Re: keep EB2 flexible

    I am happy that they are so smart people here and I wish to you good luck for your modding project. I am sorry having disturbed.

  5. #5

    Icon3 Re: keep EB2 flexible

    Quote Originally Posted by eggthief View Post
    Who needs submods for EB2? Sure there are slight gameplay changing 'mods' like the city mod but I doubt that submods like these clash a lot with the original EB. Just think before you start proposing amazing ideas again.
    Why so hostile?

    However, I agree that I don't see the point of the proposal. Are you saying that the team should not push EB2 to the limit, so that others can that?

  6. #6
    Flyboy's Avatar Libertus
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    Default Re: keep EB2 flexible

    I think it's reasonable at least with the faction card argument. Of course EB's going to fill the faction list as high as they can, but if you think historically, there are tons of factions that either weren't around during 272BCE or who were there but die off rather quickly. Considering the latter this gives no true historical base for the units rather than assumption based on the culture/region of the faction and its neigbors. The result is that if all faction slots were filled (I actually don't know the limit but I'm assuming it's a pretty high number) there would be a bunch of factions that were quickly illiminated if played by the AI, or go on in a completely unpredictable dirrection if the player takes control of them.

    Personally I would like it if maybe 1-3 faction slots were open. This still throws in an additional 5 or six new factions while giving the mod a bit of additional modability. Lets say I wanted to create a mod set in 220BCE or 130BCE or something along those lines, and I needed to include a different faction. Rather than destroying an old one and compensating with Elutheroi (or just expanding on another factions territory, depends on how far forward and where you want to go), I can just open up a faction slot, push one in there and edit with a few minor things.

    The above is just an assumption, EB will probably make effective use of all the slots if they choose to use them. But as said there are some benifits of leaving a few open.

  7. #7

    Default Re: keep EB2 flexible

    That's also a good point Flyboy but saying that some slots should remain free I was thinking on the submods and may be on eventually emerging factions during the game because of rebellion.
    How historical ever should it be EB2 but it should be a game and it should be playable. And EB1 is already very slow.
    I don't say that 50% of the slots should be kept free but
    if you you use all slotts 100% or just 98%, what is the difference. Not very much.
    But for somebody who want to create a submod it is a difference if he has 5 or nothing.
    EB is the best mod of RTW I think but if I consider the submods also, RTR with extended realism submod is about on the same level as EB 1.2.
    So why not to live some space free ? Even with 98% of the ressources used it will be enough overloaded.
    Historical accuracy is a good thing but game stability and playability is also important.

  8. #8

    Icon3 Re: keep EB2 flexible

    M2:TW allows for 31 faction slots, including the rebels. According to team members, 30 of these will be used, while the final one is left open for scripting purposes. The team has decided on which factions are going to be included months ago.

    Anyway, if a modder wants to use more faction/unit space why doesn't he remove some stuff? If these factions/units are not important, then that shouldn't be important. And if they are, why should he want to replace them?

    As for the performance, 98% or 100% is not going to make much difference in speed. Anyway, I think it a bit much to ask that the team does not "overload" the data files, while submodders are allowed to do so. I want the team to make the best possible historical simulation. If they have to overload the data files for that, then so be it.

  9. #9

    Default Re: keep EB2 flexible

    Ludens
    'Anyway, I think it a bit much to ask that the team does not "overload" the data files, while submodders are allowed to do so.'
    If somebody want more performance doesn't need to load a submod but can play with the basic mod. But if the mod it is as a monolith and not modular than he has no choice.
    So it is not the same.
    And if they are a couple of submods they give also a little bit variation and adaptation possibility.
    Ok. I 31 slots for factions are not so many but at least by buildings and units should not be used to the last one.
    And it is not the same to introduce a new emerging faction without complications if you have a slot or to remove a faction from the map before (may be from the middle of the map) and then you need to change the map again and the scripts and gameplay also.
    Of course it is also possible but more difficult.
    But of course it is a point of view. Exactly as by software.
    You can make a monolyth or a modular structure.
    Of course if you have by the instalation a couple of options what to install and what not. (for example do you want with dogs, pigs and more factions or just the minimal)
    This installation options could have the same purpuse as submods (may be even better) and in this case it would be reasonable using all slots.

  10. #10

    Icon3 Re: keep EB2 flexible

    Quote Originally Posted by Hannibalus View Post
    If somebody want more performance doesn't need to load a submod but can play with the basic mod. But if the mod it is as a monolith and not modular than he has no choice.
    So it is not the same.
    And if they are a couple of submods they give also a little bit variation and adaptation possibility.
    If someone wants performance, but not load a submod, the should not play EB . Or they can overcome their dislike of submods and create / install an EB lite submod.

    I understand what you are saying about modularity, but I imagine it's an awful lot of work. The goal of the EB team is also to create as complete a historical scenario as the engine allows, and I imagine keeping space open will conflict with that. Their job, as I see it, is to make EB as big and as good as possible, not to create an easy-to-use modding platform. Anyone who wants that, should start with M2:TW vanilla.

  11. #11

    Default Re: keep EB2 flexible

    Shurely if you all decided already how to make it than it is more difficult to change it. And it is your decision how to make. I was not speaking about making 10 different map with 10 different games just about scripts and units which are not absolutelly necessary or sometimes are created more units and not every of them introduced and then it could be a possibility where the player could take some decisions to activate parts of a script or make some elections. For example limit shipyards to some cities, smaller ships could go on bigger rivers and so on.
    Some options could take more time but other not so much.
    But even if you impose a unical historic view it is you right and everybody will be content because it is free and anyway it is very nice of you all that you contribute to this project.

  12. #12

    Icon3 Re: keep EB2 flexible

    In that case, I guess we will just agree to disagree .

    For the record, I am not an EB member.

  13. #13

    Default Re: keep EB2 flexible

    Thanks anyway that you explained to me your point of view.
    Must important that at least the developer team have an agreement what is accepted by all team member.

  14. #14

    Default Re: keep EB2 flexible

    I saw some interesting enhancements as events and interactive events by other Kingdoms mods.
    As I understood you don't plan to introduse large scale slave revolts.
    But do you plan to introduce some new events at all or you are going the old way ?
    Could be other interactive events also, not just to addopt or marry somebody.
    But some events like:
    - general xy got very unloyal, do you want to execute him or not
    - pirats are near Rome, do you want to pay them anual tribute for 10 years or risk a war with them
    - slaves became very unsatisfied, do you want to improove their situation and distribute food among them for 2.000 gold or risk a revolt
    Of course the decision by any specific event should have the proper effect in the game.

  15. #15

    Default Re: keep EB2 flexible

    They did not use all the free slots in EB1, I have made lots of mods. I am pretty sure there will be a lot of submods that can be modded under EB2.

  16. #16

    Default Re: keep EB2 flexible

    Thanks for the info.
    I don't know this submod.
    I have actually the Alexander submod over EB 1.2. I had to fix a lot of crashes until it worked but I will look this also if it works with Alexander.

  17. #17
    eggthief's Avatar Praepositus
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    Default Re: keep EB2 flexible

    Quote Originally Posted by Ludens View Post
    For the record, I am not an EB member.
    We still love you though, you're like the library of EB.

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