Don't blame CA, blame Steam

[Larry Blackmon's Codpiece]

No, I wasn't. Who the hell are you? sega's employee of the month? why are you standing up for this

And who are you? Have you even come up with an argument of your own, or do you just like repeating what everyone else says?

[boofhead]

iTunes has the same system Steam does and nobody complains there.

I did. I uninstalled it when a family member kept using it.

Microsoft monitors anyone with an Xbox 360 to make sure you can't hack the console. Nobody is complaining there.

Not me. Where I live there is no XboxLive so I don't care about MP. My Xbox has no connection with the outside world. I PLAY WHAT I PAY FOR.

Steam is nothing new. Where are you getting this idea of "RENTAL ONLY" anyway? You don't ever have to return the game or anything.

You can't sell it unless you only have 1 game on your Steam account, and you sell password and account name as well. If you play multiple games you are stuck.

And you do not own the game, you own the rights to use it. This is in the license agreement you agreed to. There's no way Steam will ever be legislated against, in fact it's going the other way as the heads of digital entertainment are even more wary about how pirates will affect their industry. Why should DRM be legislated against?

Could you elaborate on this lie in the fine print?

The lie is that the entire thing is in fine print. This is illegal in my country for most industries. They do not declare that you only rent the game and cannot onsell it.

[Lionel-Richie]

how would you react if you went to a bar and they slipped a ton of acid into your drinks? they had fine print on the doormat! didn't you read it!?!?

So you just compared having to run the game through Steam to having someone secretly making you drink acid and killing you?

[Wolfcp11]

Freedom of not having the software? Well, maybe you should exercise your "freedom" of not having a computer? It is their product, and any auxillary programs that they package with it are up to them. You were NOT forced to buy it, and you have no right to demand that they change their product for you. Your choice is buy it or don't. It is not your right to play this game, it is a priviledge.

[Slappfisk]

we buy a game to play a game, not to have all this garbage publishersdish out. how would you react if you went to a bar and they slipped a ton of acid into your drinks? they had fine print on the doormat! didn't you read it!?!?

So Steam is like lacing someone's drink with acid?

If you like steam, that's great, download it from Steam.com or wherever. we don't like steam and would like to excercise the freedom of not having it snuck onto our systems.

You don't have that freedom, only the freedom to vote with your wallet.

And once a game is opened, you can not return it for a refund in my country. you can only exchange it for another copy of the same thing. so they already have my money.

If you disagree with the EULA the publisher will refund the game.

[Larry Blackmon's Codpiece]

You can't sell it unless you only have 1 game on your Steam account, and you sell password and account name as well. If you play multiple games you are stuck.

I see, so not being able to resell your game (DRM)=renting it. Ah yes of course.

The lie is that the entire thing is in fine print. This is illegal in my country for most industries. They do not declare that you only rent the game and cannot onsell it.

Which makes this comment empty.

edit: And it's not fine print, it's not hidden print or ultra small, it's a resizable text document you are responsible for reading.

[Slappfisk]

Can we take bets on when a trigger happy moderator will end this enjoyable discussion?

[boofhead]

I see, so not being able to resell your game (DRM)=renting it. Ah yes of course.

Yes, that is 100% age old rights of possession FACT. If you rent a video you cannot onsell it. If you buy a video you can. Can't you see the difference?

Which makes this comment empty.

Which means you have ignored my statement of fact.

And it's not fine print, it's not hidden print or ultra small, it's a resizable text document you are responsible for reading.

Yes, something banks have attempted to use for years which has since been declared illegal. It's in small print on the back. I looked at a copy in the store today. If you don't agree with the license agreement you have to return it unopened to the retailer.

Pity I might be a half-blind guy who already opened it.

And don't forget all the teenagers who just want to play a game with no concept of consumer rights in their heads.

And don't forget that any contract entered into which breaks a current law is automatically null and void.

[Abraxis]

you people are ed, honestly. you're zealots, today wars are fought in the name of god or local equivilant. Tomorrow, when the guy ahead of you s up and you stumble into office they'll be in the name of the all mighty steam, or microsoft.

[Slappfisk]

Yes, that is 100% age old rights of possession FACT. If you rent a video you cannot onsell it. If you buy a video you can. Can't you see the difference?

The right of possession in this case applies to the physical media.

[Larry Blackmon's Codpiece]

Yes, that is 100% age old rights of possession FACT. If you rent a video you cannot onsell it. If you buy a video you can. Can't you see the difference?

You can't apply these "age old rights of possession" to digital content because pirates, DLC, p2p, and other such things complicate who owns exactly what. This is the crux of the matter. I don't know why you can't see owning a game, movie, or song isn't the same as owning a car. What if you decide to mass produce and resell the game? Is that right? What if CA decides to release some new levels or units for free? You didn't pay for it, but it's part of the game, so do you still own it or have any right to use it? If CA releases a patch, you probably want it but you didn't pay for it, so do you own it?

And don't forget all the teenagers who just want to play a game with no concept of consumer rights in their heads.

We can't forget those liberal-minded old schoolers who can't stop living in the past either.

[boofhead]

What if you decide to mass produce and resell the game? Is that right? What if CA decides to release some new levels or units for free? You didn't pay for it, but it's part of the game, so do you still own it? Do you own patch content?

That's a crime. Same with getting a pirated copy. It's COPYRIGHTED.

Look, the thing is here is that everyone is pirating everything, because they can. So this Steam bizzo is being used to try and stop that....so it s around with legitimate, honest people, and puts some piece of crap on their system, that they don't want. I could get a non-Steam version of ETW tomorrow if I wanted. But I wouldn't do it because it would make me a thief.

The bottom line is I won't buy it.

You guys may see Steam as some fancy fantastic thing, but I see it for what it is: a total scam that means you are renting games. They may as well say $5 a week.

In fact, give it a few years, I bet they will

[Slappfisk]

That's a crime. Same with getting a pirated copy. It's COPYRIGHTED.

Look, the thing is here is that everyone is pirating everything, because they can. So this Steam bizzo is being used to try and stop that....so it s around with legitimate, honest people, and puts some piece of crap on their system, that they don't want. I could get a non-Steam version of ETW tomorrow if I wanted. But I wouldn't do it because it would make me a thief.

The bottom line is I won't buy it.

You guys may see Steam as some fancy fantastic thing, but I see it for what it is: a total scam that means you are renting games. They may as well say $5 a week.

In fact, give it a few years, I bet they will

I am glad a visionary like you is here to educate us about this vast conspiracy.

[Vodos]

Is there a way to set these ridiculous Steam threads on ignore, I don't want them up my thread list anymore.

[boofhead]

I am glad a visionary like you is here to educate us about this vast conspiracy.

I'm not a visionary. I'm 37 years old and see this for what it is.

People will be paying monthly fees for Steam eventually. Just watch.

[Travisfv]

You sound like my brother, who believes that George Bush is part of the Illuminati, is still president, and is preparing to kill everyone in the United States.

His proof... FEMA has a lot of coffins. The Federal Emergency Management Association has a lot of coffins. Their job is disaster relief, which means removing bodies so as not to infect anyone with whatever it is on a rotting corpse.

Steam isn't some evil man trying to steal your money. , their weekend deals prove that. 25 Bucks for left 4 dead is the best 25 bucks I've spent on a video game.

[random_samurai]

We can't forget those liberal-minded old schoolers who can't stop living in the past either.

This comment makes no sense, could you clarify your use of liberal? In every sense of the word, liberal-minded would mean that he would be open to change. The statement is oxymoronic at best.

[Slappfisk]

People will be paying monthly fees for Steam eventually. Just watch.

So you believe that Valve will retroactively apply subscription fees to all games purchased through Steam?

[Vodos]

This comment makes no sense, could you clarify your use of liberal?

Liberal = Socilism

[random_samurai]

So you believe that Valve will retroactively apply subscription fees to all games purchased through Steam?

This depends on whether or not Gabe Newell will be able to keep affording candy and lard.
@Vodos- I understand that; just pointing out that the sentence made no sense.