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Thread: Cardinal Josef Ratzinger = Pope Benedict XVI

  1. #1
    Crandar's Avatar Civitate
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    Use this thread to provide links to Biographical information about Cardinal Josef Ratzinger the newly elected Pope Benedict XVI.

    You may also continue to discuss issues that face the Catholic church and then cite any reference materail that would help us to understand how the new pope might influence or impact those issues.

    Also just in case anyone is interested in dicussing the separate topic of how the pifferent Popes may be related to the Prophecies of Saint Malachi, we have a special thread open just to support that broad ranging discussion:
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/index...howtopic=28350
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  2. #2
    Mehmed II's Avatar Vicarius
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    The 62 year old guy or the black dude definitely deserved it more....sign :sad

  3. #3

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    well, that's not your business anyway.

  4. #4

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    The dude's already got his own fanclub:
    http://www.ratzingerfanclub.com/
    Quite bizarre, a fansite for a cardinal...

  5. #5
    ximan's Avatar Domesticus
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    I am so relieved. I admire this man and am sure he will do many great things however much time he is pope (He is 78, and probably has little to live). He is an extremely conservative person though, and that may offend some people, although he has some of the best discussions on pro-life issues and is a terrific writer and theologist. I suggest reading any of his works, they are stimulating and give very logical reasons for being in support of life.
    "The only good is knowledge and the only evil is ignorance."

    http://www.apollocinema.net.tc/

    ximan = pronounced "zee-man"

  6. #6

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    HABEMVS PAPAM!!! Bene Vale SS Benedetto XVI!!!!! :grin

  7. #7

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    Yay!!!
    My favorite candidate got elected! Praise the Lord! Praise the new highest represantant of divine might on earth!
    Solum sum, eram, ero.

  8. #8

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    I hear on the radio that some are already calling him 'Pope Panzer.' I hope they do, it just shows what kind of sick and hateful they are to try to conect this man to the horrors of the nazis.

  9. #9

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    Originally posted by Pinarius@Apr 19 2005, 02:40 PM
    well, that's not your business anyway.
    Considering the fact that this man is one of the most powerfull in the world, i'd say it's everybody's business

  10. #10
    JP226's Avatar Dux Limitis
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    Yea i heard the pope panzer thing on Rush. But he didn't say anybody is calling him that, he said he is waitng for someone to call him that. They are, however, already calling him Pope John Pauls rottweiler or god's rotty.
    Sure I've been called a xenophobe, but the truth is Im not. I honestly feel that America is the best country and all other countries aren't as good. That used to be called patriotism.

  11. #11
    hormiga's Avatar Senator
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    His fan club is down.... any info on his (alleged?) past with Nazi Youth? Or is this just a rumor?

  12. #12

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    He critics before had called him the Panzer Kardinal for his hard line views
    Here is a recent story about him
    The Sunday Times - World



    April 17, 2005

    Papal hopeful is a former Hitler Youth
    Justin Sparks, Munich, John Follain and Christopher Morgan, Rome



    THE wartime past of a leading German contender to succeed John Paul II may return to haunt him as cardinals begin voting in the Sistine Chapel tomorrow to choose a new leader for 1 billion Catholics.
    Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, whose strong defence of Catholic orthodoxy has earned him a variety of sobriquets — including “the enforcer”, “the panzer cardinal” and “God’s rottweiler” — is expected to poll around 40 votes in the first ballot as conservatives rally behind him.

    Although far short of the requisite two-thirds majority of the 115 votes, this would almost certainly give Ratzinger, 78 yesterday, an early lead in the voting. Liberals have yet to settle on a rival candidate who could come close to his tally.

    Unknown to many members of the church, however, Ratzinger’s past includes brief membership of the Hitler Youth movement and wartime service with a German army anti- aircraft unit.

    Although there is no suggestion that he was involved in any atrocities, his service may be contrasted by opponents with the attitude of John Paul II, who took part in anti-Nazi theatre performances in his native Poland and in 1986 became the first pope to visit Rome’s synagogue.

    “John Paul was hugely appreciated for what he did for and with the Jewish people,” said Lord Janner, head of the Holocaust Education Trust, who is due to attend ceremonies today to mark the 60th anniversary of the liberation of the Bergen-Belsen concentration camp.

    “If they were to appoint someone who was on the other side in the war, he would start at a disadvantage, although it wouldn’t mean in the long run he wouldn’t be equally understanding of the concerns of the Jewish world.”

    The son of a rural Bavarian police officer, Ratzinger was six when Hitler came to power in 1933. His father, also called Joseph, was an anti-Nazi whose attempts to rein in Hitler’s Brown Shirts forced the family to move home several times.

    In 1937 Ratzinger’s father retired and the family moved to Traunstein, a staunchly Catholic town in Bavaria close to the Führer’s mountain retreat in Berchtesgaden. He joined the Hitler Youth aged 14, shortly after membership was made compulsory in 1941.

    He quickly won a dispensation on account of his training at a seminary. “Ratzinger was only briefly a member of the Hitler Youth and not an enthusiastic one,” concluded John Allen, his biographer.

    Two years later Ratzinger was enrolled in an anti-aircraft unit that protected a BMW factory making aircraft engines. The workforce included slaves from Dachau concentration camp.

    Ratzinger has insisted he never took part in combat or fired a shot — adding that his gun was not even loaded — because of a badly infected finger. He was sent to Hungary, where he set up tank traps and saw Jews being herded to death camps. He deserted in April 1944 and spent a few weeks in a prisoner of war camp.

    He has since said that although he was opposed to the Nazi regime, any open resistance would have been futile — comments echoed this weekend by his elder brother Georg, a retired priest ordained along with the cardinal in 1951.

    “Resistance was truly impossible,” Georg Ratzinger said. “Before we were conscripted, one of our teachers said we should fight and become heroic Nazis and another told us not to worry as only one soldier in a thousand was killed. But neither of us ever used a rifle against the enemy.”

    Some locals in Traunstein, like Elizabeth Lohner, 84, whose brother-in-law was sent to Dachau as a conscientious objector, dismiss such suggestions. “It was possible to resist, and those people set an example for others,” she said. “The Ratzingers were young and had made a different choice.”

    In 1937 another family a few hundred yards away in Traunstein hid Hans Braxenthaler, a local resistance fighter. SS troops repeatedly searched homes in the area looking for the fugitive and his fellow conspirators.
    “When he was betrayed and the Nazis came for him, Braxenthaler shot himself because he knew he couldn’t escape,” said Frieda Meyer, 82, Ratzinger’s neighbour and childhood friend. “Even though they had tortured him in Dachau concentration camp he refused to give up his resistance efforts.”



    Despite question marks over Ratzinger’s wartime conduct, the main obstacle to his prospects in the conclave — the assembly of cardinals to elect the new pope — is the conservative stance he has adopted as guardian of Catholic orthodoxy since John Paul named him to head the congregation for the doctrine of the faith in 1981.

    His condemnations are legion — of women priests, married priests, dissident theologians and homosexuals, whom he has declared to be suffering from an “objective disorder”.

    He upset many Jews with a statement in 1987 that Jewish history and scripture reach fulfilment only in Christ — a position denounced by critics as “theological anti-semitism”. He made more enemies among other religions in 2000, when he signed a document, Dominus Jesus, in which he argued: “Only in the Catholic church is there eternal salvation”.

    Some of his staunchest critics are in Germany. A recent poll in Der Spiegel, the news magazine, showed opponents of a Ratzinger papacy outnumbered supporters by 36% to 29%.

    As one western cardinal who was in two minds about him put it: “He would probably be a great pope, but I have no idea how I would explain his election back home.”

    One liberal theologian,when asked what he thought of a Ratzinger papacy, was more direct: “It fills me with horror.”




  13. #13

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    Hard line pope! Do we need it? I think it is an out of date institution, that has anti-condom views in a world ravaged by aids [well Africa mainly] & over population. Although I am pro-life, there are certain circumstances where it is necessary to abort! Who wants to go back to a world of back street surgeons etc. that is the trouble with the ‘hard line’ it shows an infantile disrespect for variable circumstances. Let us not forget the appalling history of Christianity [and Islam!] – when these people had power showing their ‘true colours’ then e.g. my wife & me would have been burned – it is obvious that dualistic philosophy creates ignorance, intolerance & hatred [& war{duel - get it]. It is time people & humanity in general, started thinking for themselves not following pretenders to an invisible crown [kings of heaven] like sheep.

    I felt I had to have my say in a world that is being driven mad by religious extremes – I am not aiming this at more liberal Christians & Muslims, I am just dismayed to see a right wing [imo] hard-liners having access to millions of impressionable minds.

    My sincerest apologies if you feel insulted by this, but free speech is something I believe in – its just my 2 bits worth.
    Formerly quetzalcoatl. Proud leader of STW3 and member of the RTR, FATW and QNS teams.

  14. #14

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    Given that i respect the different religious choices of anybody(althought not necesserily and their religious leaders)and starting with the explanation that what will follow isnt by any means meant as an offence towards anybody i will say that:Catholic church has several tiems proved that when it is needed to have a leader and acions that will reform the church and move her steps forward they proved their excellent capacity to make exactly the opposite by going backwards like nothing has changed and things just because they want will follow them instead.Well they are wrong things do move forward and if churches dont follow they will be left behind.
    Thus the desicion to pick a Pope known(when he was cardinal)for his hard line is hardly a sing that cardinals realise the need to reform and be energetic in that direction when circumstances and world changes order.
    It is good to stay on the principles like freedom/equality/civility and all these but stick to the "no condom" story when HIV and other STD kill and infect millions its hardly the right thing.The world changes and its needes as well so it is either reform to meet the new or stay old and be forgoten.

  15. #15

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    Hail the new Pope! I am delighted that they decided to elect a German pope this time and a conservative one at that! He may be old but this may give the church the miracle it has been searching for! I am not Catholic but I do respect it. Long live my German brother in Christ!
    Give unto the king what is the king's, and unto God what is God's.
    -German Proverb
    Ein Volk, Ein Reich, Ein Kaiser!

  16. #16
    ZaPPPa's Avatar RTR co-daddy
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    I am afraid a very conservative pope will be a disaster for the church. It will only alienate people who are semi-religious because of things like the anti-condom standpoint because everybody knows the overpopulation is the main problem in starving Africa.. pro-life indeed.. :erm

    About the Hitler jugend thing.. As a German youngster in the war, you had to join. There was no way around it. The late prince Claus of the Netherlands (married to queen Beatrix) was active in the Hitler jugend and he rightly said that if you didn't join... you would be questioned... the Gestapo way. As long as the guy didn't try to stand up front and tried to work his way up the ranks by ratting other people out, it does not bother me too much.

  17. #17

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    Originally posted by ZaPPPa@Apr 19 2005, 04:19 PM
    I am afraid a very conservative pope will be a disaster for the church. It will only alienate people who are semi-religious because of things like the anti-condom standpoint because everybody knows the overpopulation is the main problem in starving Africa.. pro-life indeed..* :erm

    About the Hitler jugend thing.. As a German youngster in the war, you had to join. There was no way around it. The late prince Claus of the Netherlands (married to queen Beatrix) was active in the Hitler jugend and he rightly said that if you didn't join... you would be questioned... the Gestapo way. As long as the guy didn't try to stand up front and tried to work his way up the ranks by ratting other people out, it does not bother me too much.
    I disagree. I think a 'liberal' would be a disaster. I personally disagree with religion and the Catholic Church in particular. However, I do repect it becasue to it so unwilling to make 'popular' reforms. Organized religion should never change with the times. It ought to be an immovable object in that stands to break the tides of change. I can respect that.

  18. #18

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    I would have gladly died before joining the hitler jugend or anything else to do with idiotic fascists, its funny how hard-liners have no balls when it comes down to it. but if I was young & impressionable then who knows! Its also funny how things go round in circles – Christianity will end up as just a cult at this rate!
    Formerly quetzalcoatl. Proud leader of STW3 and member of the RTR, FATW and QNS teams.

  19. #19

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    I find it distaseful that they picked a former member of the Hitler Youth. Even if, years later, he claims he did it reluctantly.

    Is that the best they could do? Sigh.
    Faithfully under the patronage of the fallen yet rather amiable Octavian.

    Smile! The better the energy you put in, the better the energy you will get out.

  20. #20

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    Originally posted by Petite Pete+Apr 19 2005, 05:26 PM--></div><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td> (Petite Pete @ Apr 19 2005, 05:26 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-ZaPPPa@Apr 19 2005, 04:19 PM
    I am afraid a very conservative pope will be a disaster for the church. It will only alienate people who are semi-religious because of things like the anti-condom standpoint because everybody knows the overpopulation is the main problem in starving Africa.. pro-life indeed..* :erm

    About the Hitler jugend thing.. As a German youngster in the war, you had to join. There was no way around it. The late prince Claus of the Netherlands (married to queen Beatrix) was active in the Hitler jugend and he rightly said that if you didn&#39;t join... you would be questioned... the Gestapo way. As long as the guy didn&#39;t try to stand up front and tried to work his way up the ranks by ratting other people out, it does not bother me too much.
    I disagree. I think a &#39;liberal&#39; would be a disaster. I personally disagree with religion and the Catholic Church in particular. However, I do repect it becasue to it so unwilling to make &#39;popular&#39; reforms. Organized religion should never change with the times. It ought to be an immovable object in that stands to break the tides of change. I can respect that. [/b][/quote]
    Then why has church moved? Why they didn&#39;t stand against the tide and stick to some of their old dogmas like geocentric system, after all they considered it so important detail that people supporting heliocentric view were put through lot of trouble by catholic church?

    Just one example on how church must live with past, not in it.

    Stubborn resilience will only cost the church as world goes forward and church does not. They will lose respect when they stick to ideas that have been abandoned by humanity as unwise and distance the people from itself by refusing to open up to new things instead of denying them.

    Jesus was a radical of his time, so why is church behaving like those jewish priests in the bible instead of way Jesus went on and was committed to change from old, cumbersome traditions to something new?


    Everyone is warhero, genius and millionaire in Internet, so don't be surprised that I'm not impressed.

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