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Thread: Is E:TW modable?

  1. #1

    Default Is E:TW modable?

    Ok, so i finally got the game. But there are quite a few things that piss me off. First of all, it's IMPOSSIBLE to mod the game. They've completely changed the structure of the files and encrypted a lot of them, making it impossible to mod anything other than historical battles. You can't mod unit sizes (which are WAY too small) in the grand campaign. You can't mod the movement rate (which is also way too low) of units. You can't mod the costs or turns it takes to build buildings (which again takes way too long). Basically the game runs at a snail's pace due to the low movement rates and long build times, and the battles feel extremely lame and un-epic due to the microscopic unit sizes.

    Let me give you an example. I played as Sweden, and had an army stationed in the baltic. So i decide to reinforce it with a few line infantry and cavalry and artillery. So the units get built in my surrounding provinces (Finland, Ingria, Sweden and the last one i can't remember the name of). Then they automatically move to join my army. Now, the first few units that were built in finland and the baltic provinces reached the army in just 2 or 3 turns (which is still slow as hell considering 3 turns equals 1.5 years), but the ones that were built in Sweden took FOREVER to get to my army, even though i had upgraded all my roads to cobbled roads. It literally took them FOUR YEARS (8 turns) to move from stockholm to the baltic. That's a distance of a few hundred km AT THE MOST!


    Of course by that time Corea (or whatever the hell their name is, they're a minor nation in the baltic with just one province on the border of my baltic province that i can't remember the name of) had besieged and completely pwned my province and taken it over. This is partly my own fault for disbanding the militia and pikeman unit in my army in that province, since i wanted to replace them with the line infantry that was on its way from sweden. I thought it would only take 2 or 3 turns at the most for them to get to my army, so i figured nobody would attack my during that time. But while they happily spent multiple years crawling from Sweden to the baltic, corea had enough time to build a huge army and rape my province.


    Then there's the fact that it takes at least 2 turns to build even the cheapest and crappiest buildings. The higher level ones take even longer (5 turns or more) which means that with the excrusiatingly slow speed at which turns get processed, it literally takes 5 minutes of real time to upgrade a farm. This means that the "turtle" tactic (my favourite tactic) takes like half the game to implement. For those who don't know, the turtle tactic means you fully upgrade all your current provinces and fortify them and strengthen them before taking any new ones. That way you won't have to worry about defending your old provinces, just the new one you just took. Then you fully upgrade that province too before taking the next one, and so on. This tactic becomes impossible unless you want to spend the first 200 turns (and since each turns takes like 30 seconds to process, even on my q9450 quad core, you'll have to wait a while) of the game just upgrading your provinces before you start fighting any wars, which is what i always do. I never like to fight wars unprepared, i want to be as well prepared as possible so i can deal with anything unexpected, which becomes impossible unless you have fully upgraded provinces.

    Then someone at CA had the marvellous idea of removing the prisoners feature (which was avaliable in MTW2) as well as the pre-battle general's speeches, as well as blood and dirt on your soldiers, all of which were avaliable in MTW2.


    Finally, to add insult to injury, they've made the game impossible to mod, which could have fixed 90% of the suckage and actually made the game fun to play. As it stands now, the only improvements with this game are the graphics, battle animations, streamlining of the diplomacy, naval battles, a slightly larger world map and the ability to recruit and retrain units outside settlements. But these are all minor improvements, and the minimum you would expect of a whole new game. When you subtract all the negative from the positive, the net result is a game that is a 5 out of 10 at best. Obviously, once modding becomes possible and i get to mod out all the suckage, the game will be an 8 out of ten, at the minimum. But all the stuff they took out and neutered from the previous games means it will never be a perfect 10, maybe not even a 9. Hopefully all, or at the very least most of the missing features can be modded back in. But i'm not holding my breath.

  2. #2

    Default Re: What do you think is negative about the full version?

    Writing such a review is a bit early dont you think?

    What I can say know is that I think that the towns is pretty uggly and to colorfull, but thats about all
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  3. #3
    Stuie's Avatar Laudir Agus Mir
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    Default Re: What do you think is negative about the full version?

    You couldn't mod Rome out of the box either - people had to figure out how to unpack the necessary files. Chill out and give it some time.

  4. #4

    Default Re: What do you think is negative about the full version?

    Modding will be figured out. I agree wholeheartedly on the low movement for units. Keep those movement rates and switch it to 4 turns per year and it would be acceptable.


  5. #5

    Default Re: What do you think is negative about the full version?

    Quote Originally Posted by Stuie View Post
    You couldn't mod Rome out of the box either - people had to figure out how to unpack the necessary files. Chill out and give it some time.
    No, you're wrong. RTW is fully moddable straight out of the box thanks to the fact that all the relevant data is stored in easily editable text files. Unlike the files in ETW which are encrypted, and stored in pack files which are also encrypted.

  6. #6

    Default Re: What do you think is negative about the full version?

    I still have 5 hours until I get my copy, but it sounds like a lot of your frustration is due to learning how THIS game plays, time, distances, etc.

    I honestly don't think because you didn't appreciate (yet) how long an army takes to travel, or how long it takes to make a building or unit, combined with your admittedly naive mistake of disbanding defensive units before their relief arrived, is reason enough to slam the game.

    I would like to hear of your feelings in a month or two, when you have digested the parameters of THIS game.
    "oooh a gypsy wind is blowing warm tonight, sky is starlit and the time is right. Now you're telling me you have to go...before you do there's something you should know." - Bob Seger

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  7. #7

    Default Re: What do you think is negative about the full version?

    you need to play the game, your troops can move longer as you research techs for example


  8. #8

    Default Re: What do you think is negative about the full version?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mikelus Trento View Post
    I still have 5 hours until I get my copy, but it sounds like a lot of your frustration is due to learning how THIS game plays, time, distances, etc.

    I honestly don't think because you didn't appreciate (yet) how long an army takes to travel, or how long it takes to make a building or unit, combined with your admittedly naive mistake of disbanding defensive units before their relief arrived, is reason enough to slam the game.

    I would like to hear of your feelings in a month or two, when you have digested the parameters of THIS game.
    No, it simply does not take FOUR YEARS to travel 200 km!!! Not ever, not even in the stone age! And there is nothing to digest, either. The time it takes to build stuff simply sucks, period. I never played RTW or MTW2 with build times longer than 1 turn for every building, simply because i didn't have the patience to press end turn 30 times just to build one building. I am never going to get used to these build times or movement rates, because they are simply mind numbingly slow, and i want to actually play the game instead of clicking end turn 8 times just to watch my army move a few meters per decade. And as i said before, i would be the happiest guy in the world if i could just mod it the way i want it to be. I wouldn't even be on this forum complaining, i'd mod it the way i wanted it and play for 48 straight until i pass out. But the fact that i CAN'T mod any of it, and i am FORCED to accept the suckage pisses me off to no end.




    Quote Originally Posted by bobkat View Post
    you need to play the game, your troops can move longer as you research techs for example

    I shouldn't have to research anything, because even a caveman from the stone age could move faster than the armies in this game. They take 4 years to move 500km at the most. Let's do the math and see what that comes out to:

    500,000 (500km equals 500,000 meters) / 35040 (the number of hours in 4 years; 365*4*24) = 14. In other words they move 14 meters per hour.


    That's 0,014km/h.


    Even if the total distance travelled was 20,000km (half the circumference of the earth) the speed would only be about 20,000,000 / 35040 = 570 meters per hour.


    That's 0,57km/h...


    A newborn infant can crawl faster than that. So no, i shouldn't have to research anything. They shouldn't need the help of any ing technology to move faster than an infant.
    Last edited by Serben; March 04, 2009 at 07:26 AM.

  9. #9

    Default Re: What do you think is negative about the full version?



  10. #10

    Default Re: What do you think is negative about the full version?

    Quote Originally Posted by Serben View Post
    No, it simply does not take FOUR YEARS to travel 200 km!!! Not ever, not even in the stone age! And there is nothing digest, either. The time it takes to build stuff simply sucks, period. I never played RTW or MTW2 with build times longer than 1 turn for every building, simply because i didn't have the patience to press end turn 30 times just to build one building. I am never going to get used to these build times or movement rates, because they are simply mind numbingly slow, and i want to actually play the game instead of clicking end turn 8 times just to watch my army move a few meters per decade. I have an extremely low level of patience, so there is simply no way i am ever going to accept these movement rates and build times. And as i said before, i would be the happiest guy in the world if i could just mod it the way i want it to be. I wouldn't even be on this forum complaining, i'd mod it the way i wanted it and play for 48 straight until i pass out. But the fact that i CAN'T mod any of it, and i am FORCED to accept the suckage pisses me off to no end.







    I shouldn't have to research anything, because even a caveman from the stone age could move faster than the armies in this game. They take 4 years to move 500km at the most. Let's do the math and see what that comes out to:

    500,000 (500km equals 500,000 meters) / 35040 (the number of hours in 4 years; 365*4*24) = 14. In other words they move 14 meters per hour. Even if the total distance travelled was 20,000km (half the circumference of the earth) the speed would only be about 20,000,000 / 35040 = 570 meters per hour. That's 0,57km/h. A newborn infant can crawl faster than that. So no, i shouldn't have to research anything. They shouldn't need the help of any f.ucking technology to move faster than an infant.
    TW games have NEVER accurately reflected time and distance a unit can travel. Nothing different there at all.

    This is because they are games, not simulations, especially at the campaign level. Why weren't you annoyed when it would take a Roman Legion 10 or 12 years to march from Rome to Spain, when Hannibal covered that distance (with elephants mind you) in 1 year?
    "oooh a gypsy wind is blowing warm tonight, sky is starlit and the time is right. Now you're telling me you have to go...before you do there's something you should know." - Bob Seger

    Freedom is the distance between church and state.

  11. #11

    Default Re: What do you think is negative about the full version?

    Quote Originally Posted by bobkat View Post
    you need to play the game, your troops can move longer as you research techs for example
    if what he says is true though about its taking 4 game years to move distances of about 100k then I dont care if they have to hike through mountains (much less paved/cobbled roads) that is ridiculous.

    also the speech's were fun, its too bad they took them out

    the dirt thing is too bad too, it seems as the graphics get better companies sometimes also move to make games falsely prettier (ie: glowing Indians HDR bloom effect... or super clean uniforms).

    the blood is too bad, I really hope this can be modded in... anyone remember the original total wars, war isnt pretty... if anything when you clean it up for a high profile/big budget the way this TW is your are glorifying war in a way I dont approve of.

  12. #12

    Default Re: What do you think is negative about the full version?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mikelus Trento View Post
    TW games have NEVER accurately reflected time and distance a unit can travel. Nothing different there at all.

    This is because they are games, not simulations, especially at the campaign level. Why weren't you annoyed when it would take a Roman Legion 10 or 12 years to march from Rome to Spain, when Hannibal covered that distance (with elephants mind you) in 1 year?

    Who said i wasn't annoyed by this in RTW? But the difference between rome and ETW is that i could actually CHANGE IT!! Which i did. I increased movement rates in RTW by a factor of at least 40.


    Why do you keep making comparisons with RTW? I already said at least 3 times in this thread that at least in RTW you could actually CHANGE something you didn't like. In ETW you can't since they encrypted all the ing files. Which part of this confuses you?

  13. #13

    Default Re: What do you think is negative about the full version?

    The part where you are still confused by thinking the campaign game is a simulation rather than a game.
    "oooh a gypsy wind is blowing warm tonight, sky is starlit and the time is right. Now you're telling me you have to go...before you do there's something you should know." - Bob Seger

    Freedom is the distance between church and state.

  14. #14

    Default Re: What do you think is negative about the full version?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mikelus Trento View Post
    TW games have NEVER accurately reflected time and distance a unit can travel. Nothing different there at all.

    This is because they are games, not simulations, especially at the campaign level. Why weren't you annoyed when it would take a Roman Legion 10 or 12 years to march from Rome to Spain, when Hannibal covered that distance (with elephants mind you) in 1 year?
    the thing is apart from accelerating the tech tree and the games "excitement" as you speed race through historical points etc.. there is not reason at all to have units not move accurate distances.

    sure if you made them move accurate distances under the current turn to time ratio armies would fly all over the place, and it would be difficult to keep tabs and maneuver. However if you made each turn a 1/4 of a year for example this would slow the game down considerably. Each battle would feel more important and the scope would feel more realistic.

    I do however dis-agree on your opinion with build times, they should not be as short as you are saying (though possibly shorter)
    Last edited by SingeDebile; March 04, 2009 at 07:35 AM.

  15. #15

    Default Re: What do you think is negative about the full version?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mikelus Trento View Post
    The part where you are still confused by thinking the campaign game is a simulation rather than a game.


    I'm not confused. You are. I don't care if it's not an accurate simulation or not. I just want to be able to CHANGE IT! ETW doesn't suck because of the slow movement rates, it sucks because it FORCES those movement rates on me, leaving me no choice but to accept them against my will, unlike every other TW game since MTW1 (shogun was the only one that wasn't moddable).

  16. #16
    jimkatalanos's Avatar 浪人
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    Default Re: What do you think is negative about the full version?

    Calm down please...
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  17. #17

    Default Re: What do you think is negative about the full version?

    Quote Originally Posted by Serben View Post
    leaving me no choice
    CA is holding a gun to your head making you play something you don't enjoy?

    Seriously though, I understand exactly what you are saying, but I hope the inability this time around to change movement rates doesn't cause you to not enjoy the many fine features of this new game.
    "oooh a gypsy wind is blowing warm tonight, sky is starlit and the time is right. Now you're telling me you have to go...before you do there's something you should know." - Bob Seger

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  18. #18
    murat can's Avatar Semisalis
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    Default Re: What do you think is negative about the full version?

    campaign map slow response time is the only problem for me, i try to move left from campaign map for example, and it doesnt move for a second or two. then it moves, i dont think its my computer.


  19. #19

    Default Re: What do you think is negative about the full version?

    Quote Originally Posted by Serben View Post
    In ETW you can't since they encrypted all the ing files.
    So basically you're saying that there won't be a single mod out there for ETW?
    Let's be clear here, encrypted as in, all packed in one file or encrypted as in, all packed in one file only able to be unpacked by a certain key?

  20. #20

    Default Re: What do you think is negative about the full version?

    Quote Originally Posted by murat can View Post
    campaign map slow response time is the only problem for me, i try to move left from campaign map for example, and it doesnt move for a second or two. then it moves, i dont think its my computer.
    There's no delay if you use awsd or the arrow keys.

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