"Greece wants Alexander the Great statue in Iraq"

[removeduser_487563287433]

I doubt any modern Greek would mind seeing a statue of Alexander in any country of the world that doesn't use the statue for propaganda. It's actually great to see a Greek honoured in a foreign country.

That's absurd, a statue is almost always propaganda. I mean, if you think of a statue of Alexander the Great what do you see? A man who seems to be infinitely beautiful, healthy, dressed in armour in an energetic pose.

Do you not realise that is in itself propaganda, that it derives from combining Alexander's image with that of Apollo?

[Aradan]

That's absurd, a statue is almost always propaganda. I mean, if you think of a statue of Alexander the Great what do you see? A man who seems to be infinitely beautiful, healthy, dressed in armour in an energetic pose.

Do you not realise that is in itself propaganda, that it derives from combining Alexander's image with that of Apollo?

There's a fine line separating propaganda from commemoration.

Do you have any ideas as to what exactly Alexander's statue propagandizes in Iraq? The beauty of being conquered by a white, blond guy? If that's the case, then ok, we're not happy about Alexander being used in such a way; but not even nationalists can claim it poses a threat to greek history.

[removeduser_487563287433]

There's a fine line separating propaganda from commemoration.

Do you have any ideas as to what exactly Alexander's statue propagandizes in Iraq? The beauty of being conquered by a white, blond guy? If that's the case, then ok, we're not happy about Alexander being used in such a way; but not even nationalists can claim it poses a threat to greek history.

And what about the fact that Alexander the Great is an integral part of Iraqi history?

[Aradan]

I am not sure about how Iraqis view Alexander, to be honest. He sure did change the history of the people of the region, but the same did the Romans when they conquered Greece; we don't really look up to roman emperors in a heavenly positive light - yes, I know it's not the same. Let's assume the Iraqis do consider Alexander an important part of their history and want to honour him. What is the statue's purpose? A reminder of the past? An invitation to unite for a common patriotic goal and rebuild the country? A prod to pick up arms and kick the US out? A sign that the country can prosper under the rule of white, blond dudes that know what's best for Iraqis?
The statue itself is neither good (commemoration) nor bad (propaganda). It's how it's used that makes it one of the two.

Again assuming the statue is used for some kind of propaganda, what I meant to say earlier was that Iraq doesn't claim Alexander as "their own" using the statue in that way. They do recognise he played an integral role in shaping the history of their people and region, but that's the end of it. It's the same way we Greeks name streets after the french/english/russian admirals of the naval battle of Navarino. We honour them, they did play an important part in our history, we know they belong to their respective countries, the end.

[removeduser_487563287433]

See... there's that "belong" bollocks that modern Greeks insist upon. It's absurd. I consider the Roman Empire an integral part of British history, and I would laugh at any Italian that said the statue of Constantine in York had to be torn down.

[Akrotatos]

I doubt any modern Greek would mind seeing a statue of Alexander in any country of the world that doesn't use the statue for propaganda. It's actually great to see a Greek honoured in a foreign country.

x2

Likewise no Greek has a problem with small towns named Athens or Macedonia in US..

EDIT: Alexander was not blonde people.

[Aradan]

See... there's that "belong" bollocks that modern Greeks insist upon. It's absurd. I consider the Roman Empire an integral part of British history, and I would laugh at any Italian that said the statue of Constantine in York had to be torn down.

You seem to be confusing two different concepts. Alexander was a Greek. In that sense, he belongs to Greece. With his actions he shaped the history of many other peoples as well. Therefore he played in integral part to their history. Influencing a nation's history by one's actions does not make one a part of this nation. That's my point. As long as Alexander is identified correctly as a Greek, no Greek would ever have a problem with him being a statue in any part of the world.



Akrotatos: What? he wasn't blonde?! Srsly? Because I saw a movie and I'm definitely sure he was...

[Arto]

I would rather have the statue in the center of Skopje.

[MathiasOfAthens]

And if you rather see it in Skopje then Id rather see a couple miles from Thesalonica in modern greece.
________
CAT WHEEL

[Aradan]

That is the second time you're posting this, at a totally random point of the discussion, and it's hardly contributing to it.
If you are trying to make a point, let's hear it. If you're trying to pick a fight, or troll or just be off-topic, better stop.

Skopjans are welcome to erect a statue of Alexander there, as long as he's clearly identified as a Greek.

[Eastern Roman]

I know modern Greeks like to claim that they and they alone represent and have some sort of copywrite on ancient history...

lol

I doubt any modern Greek would mind seeing a statue of Alexander in any country of the world that doesn't use the statue for propaganda. It's actually great to see a Greek honoured in a foreign country.

x2

Likewise no Greek has a problem with small towns named Athens or Macedonia in US..

X3

And if you rather see it in Skopje then Id rather see a couple miles from Thesalonica in modern greece.

there you go

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

http://lh4.ggpht.com/_lV15r34bB5s/SDKhl0sWOcI/AAAAAAAAAKQ/Pbst6P3OQ9M/%CE%98%CE%95%CE%A3%CE%A3%CE%91%CE%9B%CE%9F%CE%9D%CE%99%CE%9A%CE%97+%CE%91%CE%93%CE%91%CE%9B%CE%9C%CE%91+%CE%9C%CE%95%CE%93%CE%91%CE%9B%CE%9F%CE%A5+%CE%91%CE%9B%CE%95%CE%9E%CE%91%CE%9D%CE%94%CE%A1%CE%9F%CE%A5.jpg

[MathiasOfAthens]

Karakalos it didnt come in can you redo the insert image link? Make sure that you right clicked on the picture and selected copy Image URL.
________
Hurt from avandia

[removeduser_487563287433]

You seem to be confusing two different concepts. Alexander was a Greek. In that sense, he belongs to Greece. With his actions he shaped the history of many other peoples as well. Therefore he played in integral part to their history. Influencing a nation's history by one's actions does not make one a part of this nation. That's my point. As long as Alexander is identified correctly as a Greek, no Greek would ever have a problem with him being a statue in any part of the world.



Akrotatos: What? he wasn't blonde?! Srsly? Because I saw a movie and I'm definitely sure he was...

I find the idea of history "belonging" to anybody or anything absurdly laughable. History is just the truth of what happened in the past, and as abstract cannot be owned.

[Romios]

Last time i checked the definition of the word "propaganda" it was the dissemination of information aimed at influencing the opinions or behaviors of large numbers of people.

How can ever a statue do that?

[removeduser_487563287433]

Quite easily. I mean like I said Alexander the Great statues are always merged with attributes of traditional statues of Apollo in order to suggest that his faculties were shared by Alexander. Statues of Roman emperors up to Hadrian all reflect statues of Alexander to suggest they have the faculties of Alexander. Look at this statue of Augustus; a notorious example of how a statue can be propaganda:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

This has it all. It borrows heavily from statues of Alexander as you can see with the Cow's Lick fringe and the style of leaning on one foot.(This would no doubt be viewed by modern Greeks as "stealing" history). He's caked in armour that is decorated with images of battles, Gods and Augustus' success in regaining the Eagles that the Parthians took. He is young, healthy and militaristic.

And a world away from Augustus the man.

[Romios]

All statues exaggerate handsomeness for vanity purposes i believe, not propaganda. It's not like the statue itself distorts any major historical truth.

Its a different matter however what political intentions are possibly hidden behind the placement of a statue in a particular area.

[removeduser_487563287433]

That statue majorly warps the image of Augustus for propaganda purposes.

[Eastern Roman]

it's no use... greek plans for taking Iraq has been revealed !
did you all forgot ?
"beware of Greeks bearing gifts"

[Stavroforos]

I doubt any modern Greek would mind seeing a statue of Alexander in any country of the world that doesn't use the statue for propaganda. It's actually great to see a Greek honoured in a foreign country.

Funny story about that...

Here in Toronto, there is a Greek neighborhood, which is also a Macedonian (FYROM) neighborhood, so there's always some bad blood. Well, the Greek council of the neighborhood decided to erect a statue of Alexander the Great in a little plaza, so that the Macedonians could know "who's boss" here.

What Alexander the Great has to do with Canada, I have no idea. I would have much preferred a statue of a modern Greek, but alas, propaganda must work its magical ways.

That being said, I don't believe that the statue in Iraq has a propagandistic purpose.

[Dodge]

This thread would have been HILARIOUS if the word 'Greece' in the topic title was replaced with '(FYRO)Macedonia'