Open or hidden polls?

[Aldgarkalaughskel]

Should we have open or hidden polls in the AAR competitions voting?

You decide.

PS this is the new poll option that lets you make hidden polls.

edit: this will be applied in ToTW as well

[Xavier Dragnesi]

I say open. It creates a better atmosphere in the voting thread, an atmosphere of tension and excitement throughout the whole thing. If it's hidden, then you're only anticipating the winner, not feeling the ebb and flow of votes, like when one AAR overtakes another, or falls behind another etc.

[Gaius Baltar]

Open. Part of the creative process is feedback, and voting explanations are an important part of that system.

[Lysimachos]

I quote myself from the social group:

I really don't know. I guess it's more fair with secret results.
On the other hand it is less interesting and in my opinion less suspenseful, because you can't regularly have a look "How is it going now? And now? Any change? What is that AAR that's getting so many votes, have I even read it?"... I hope you get what I'm trying to express. Once you made your vote you have no reason to waste a thought about the competition until the voting is over.

I think over all I prefer open votes, especially if the voting period is longer than a couple of days.

Edit: Oh, are we getting some bandwagoning here

[molls]

hidden all the way,
higher chance that people actually vote for the stories they like, not for those 5 that lead. (cos it is futile to vote for those already behind)

everyone of you has voted at least once for the leading guys, instead of those who you actually wanted to vote in the beginning.

While this is not so crucial in the AAR comp (multivote!) it is in the PotW.
Im trying this in TotW this time and will see myself if something is going to change!

[Musthavename]

Hidden.

Fairness should come before curiosity.

Say a person loves A, and also likes B & C. Suppose A & B are competing for the lead. This person will change his vote and not vote for B as he wants A to win first and foremost. B should have deserved a vote here, but didn't, because the results were visible. Thats not even counting bandwagoning.

[Babagitta]

I say both of them.
Hidden if there are less than 12-15 nominations and
Open if we have more than 15.

[LlamaD]

thou shall hide the hidden.
Why is this vote not hidden? Biased, imo.

[Theodotos I]

For whatever reason, I'm never able to see the results until after I place my vote, so I have never been tempted to bandwagon. And yes, for myself, the fun is somewhat gone from this contest. The last two months I spent competition week checking the forums every chance I got and cheering with excitement with each fresh vote. Now. . .there's nothing. Just a long, hard wait. I wish this had been put to a vote beforehand instead of sprung on us in this fashion.

[snuggans]

hidden all the way,
higher chance that people actually vote for the stories they like, not for those 5 that lead. (cos it is futile to vote for those already behind)

everyone of you has voted at least once for the leading guys, instead of those who you actually wanted to vote in the beginning.

While this is not so crucial in the AAR comp (multivote!) it is in the PotW.
Im trying this in TotW this time and will see myself if something is going to change!

Hidden.

Fairness should come before curiosity.

Say a person loves A, and also likes B & C. Suppose A & B are competing for the lead. This person will change his vote and not vote for B as he wants A to win first and foremost. B should have deserved a vote here, but didn't, because the results were visible. Thats not even counting bandwagoning.

agreed.

it seems writers like hidden, and the rest like open just because they get their jollies from the tension. hide the results until the poll closes, not forever. THEN there will be room for critique.

[Theodotos I]

agreed.

it seems writers like hidden, and the rest like open just because they get their jollies from the tension. hide the results until the poll closes, not forever. THEN there will be room for critique.

I'm a writer and I like the tension. I respect your opinion, but you happened to miss mine. No hard feelings, man.

[snuggans]

I'm a writer and I like the tension. I respect your opinion, but you happened to miss mine. No hard feelings, man.

it's a generalization

[Lysimachos]

it's a generalization

Not to become nit-picky on this or something, but until now everyone who has posted here has written/is writing at least one AAR, so we are all writers

[Musthavename]

For whatever reason, I'm never able to see the results until after I place my vote, so I have never been tempted to bandwagon

Theres a button below the poll that says "Show Poll Results".

[Xavier Dragnesi]

Yeah, but I'm one of those people who never clicks on those before voting So I always vote for the ones I like no matter if it's hidden or not.

[Babagitta]

I say both of them.
Hidden if there are less than 12-15 nominations and
Open if we have more than 15.

Well I can't vote but do not take it as abstain/don't know/don't care.
My suggestion is specific.

[Juvenal]

I have agonised about this for a while, but I think I have finally managed to arrive at a conclusion.

Secret voting tackles bandwagons, but dampens enthusiasm for the vote. I think that we should continue with secret votes, but reduce the voting period to just a single day.

This means that everyone sees the results before they "go off the boil".

It will be necessary to make sure that the voting day is prominently displayed in all the pre-vote publicity. There needs to be a run-up to the vote during which people are encouraged to read the stories and make their decision.

We should have a pre-vote discussion thread where people comment on the nominations and do their electioneering in public. This replaces the current practice of following the voting while deciding which bandwagon to jump on.

Please let me have your thoughts on this.

[Musthavename]

I agree with shortening the voting period. But one day is way too short. Someone could easily forget. 3 days is probably a minimum imo. As in most contests so far, after 3-4 days the votes start to level off.

[Aldgarkalaughskel]

I didn't want to make an opening statement, because I think it would have affected the poll results, but as the most of you, the voters have shared your opinion by now, it's time to share mine.

At first, the use of hidden polls seemed to be a good idea (and still think it has some positive proceeds), because they could reduce the bandwagoning.

But as a side effect they also mask voting behaviours.

More people able to view the poll results = bigger the chance to detect inappropriate voting behaviours such as "bribed" votes, alt accounts voting for themselves etc.

Open polls also lead to better transparency and accountability.

I agree with Xavi and Lysimachos, that it creates a better atmoshpere in the voting thread (which increases the fun factor of the competition - after all it is supposed to be for fun, don't forget it); and also agree with GB that feedback is an important part of the creative process. I also like to remind you, that the voting abuses in both ToTW and PoTW happened not so long ago; and in both cases not the moderators were the first to react to the unusual scamper of a contestant's votes, simply because they must be impartial, and shouldn't accuse someone of cheating without hard evidences. (In the case of ToTW I could obtain these hard evidences only a week after the accident happened. On another occasion, I observed an unusual scamper of votes again, checked the subforum, and a thread had to be deleted... but if I couldn't check this in time, it would have caused some problems).

I also find Babagitta's idea interesting

I say both of them.
Hidden if there are less than 12-15 nominations and
Open if we have more than 15.

But I don't know what it's based upon. So Baba, if you could elaborate this idea, we'd be listening.

Juvenal's idea is viable too

I think that we should continue with secret votes, but reduce the voting period to just a single day.

but unfortunately it is technically not possible. You have 3 options when creating a poll:
1. always show results
2. always hide results
3. show results when finished

It is true, that some voters will look at the poll results before voting and choose the leading ones - too bad for them. They would vote randomly (and not by substantive deliberation) in a secret poll anyway. It's part of the voting process. But the alternative of this is to completely terminate public voting, and hand out only jury-awarded points, which I wouldn't be fond of, as it would kill the fun, and the community feeling of the whole competition. I like the current system, I think it's balanced and fair, and rewards everyone's talents.

[Musthavename]

but unfortunately it is technically not possible. You have 3 options when creating a poll:
1. always show results
2. always hide results
3. show results when finished

Couldn't you just lock the thread the poll was in after the time has elapsed. Wouldn't that disable people from voting in it aswell as posting in it?