Medieval Total War - Redux (Beta)

[Axalon]

I just like to ask is it hard to mod the original Medieval Total War?

It depends on what you want to do... Some things are real easy, some things are real hard, some things can't be done at all (due to hardcoding). Of all TW-games that you can mod, to any serious degree, MTW is probably the least favoured and supported of all, and that reality is not making work with it any easier. Less infrastructure, formal support, recognition, resources, guides, space and the like. All of which are true and valid for Redux too. On general terms I have been told that it is tougher to mod MTW1 then it is RTW1 and MTW2 - that is at least a common opinion amongst many RTW-modders. I have no idea of later games, and to be honest I never did bother to get a somehow informed opinion about that stuff either...

***

The next question... From Leeekaaa... Not very Redux-related either... I mean Sicily as a faction is not even part of Redux, so... I kind of wonder how and why this question ended up here? After all, this thread is dedicated to Redux and little else. One would think all this would be obvious, right? Anyhow, a decent enough answer on this question can be found in the MTW mod-thread, refer to that stuff (for starters). Now folks, feel free to post questions and/or remarks actually related to Redux instead and leave all other stuff for other threads elsewhere. Everybody wins...

- A

[Axalon]

Everyone alright with their Redux-games? Anyone playing some RX1005e at this time?

- A

[Gyro]

ok here.
Played through most of the winter.

Gyro

[Ironlich]

The link is broken, it says it's impossible to open the page.

[Axalon]

Try this stuff, everything is included in this single package. Including the latest fix for all V.2.01 users (fixing some "torned" castle flags)....

I've uploaded RXB1005, RXB1005VI, RX Unipatch and Axalon's last "textures" patch to MEGA. That should solve most download problems:
https://mega.nz/#!VNsTmTjQ!8rkGp04Fa...5OChZ31gy-wWFk

- A

[Respenus]

Observations on a Short French Campaign: Or Why Redux Rules

It has taken me a while to get to it, but I have finally managed to sink my teeth into a Redux campaign and get to 890 as the French on Standard difficulty. As the title implies, I was more than satisfied and will explain in greater detail below. I would just like to add that this is the first time I have played a MTW campaign, so some of the things I will write down will concern hardcoded issues I am unaware off, for which I apologise.

Campaign AI:

I do not know what Redux does to the Campaign AI, but the first 100 years or so were very peaceful, with everyone setting up alliances with everyone and no wars happening at all between the major factions. This is not something I am complaining about, as it gave me the time to expand and build up my economy, so that by the time things heated up, I was well armed and supported by a strong economy.

However, there is one problem with the diplomacy AI that I observed. In one case England decided to attack me just as it was dealing with the Viking invasion, losing Normandy in the process and even then, they never accepted my peace offering, but waited several years before offering one themselves. In another case, Germany attacked me, I beat it back, offered peace two turns afterwards and they accepted it, even though they had large stacks amassed in neighbouring provinces. The craziest case, however, were the Moors. They attacked me, I beat them back, offered peace, they accepted and immediately the following turn, they attacked again. Maybe this is something that came with the original MTW and cannot be modded out, but I still felt it should be reported.

A bigger problem, however, is present in the building part of the Campaign AI. Concerning units, the Moors were predominantly armed with slaves and naptha throwers, rather than high-end infantry, even though they could certainly afford it. It was the same with the other factions I had intel on: a lot of low end troops such as levy spearmen, with heavy troops either surviving from the beginning or represented by generals and faction members. So there is certainly a preference for quantity over quality, even when the economy permits it. The AI is also slow on developing its provinces, but this is less visible and the AI managed to do a fair job at economic management.

Combat:

This is where Redux really shines. Thanks to extensive balancing, each unit feels unique and packs its own punch. This is also the first TW game where the combat felt "meaty", as if there were real soldiers fighting on the battlefield. A charge by Royal Knights will all but annihilate basic units and marching a large force against a demoralised enemy will result in a massive rout (no way a slave is going to stand in the way of Frankish Swordsmen unless really forced to).

Furthermore, the AI knows its job on the battlefield and is more than capable of kicking me around. It is far, far better than anything else I have seen in other TW games and the enemy will exploit every defensive and offensive advantage it can. Consequently, playing Redux is not merely a question of marching in superior troops and cutting down everything in front of you and even the weakest foe can struck a killing blow if underestimated.

In only have one complaint. In sieges, infantry attacking castle doors is far, far OP. I have seen basic infantry troops break line after line of castle defences and taking only a few casualties. This is something I have also seen in other MTW mods, so I am guessing this is a hardcoded issue. Still, if there is a way to make doors harder to break, it would inject extra realism into the mod.

Economy:

Like everything else, the economy is extremely well balanced. I have played MTW2 mods with RR/RC and Redux is the MTW equivalent of it. It is clear that the tech tree and buildings costs are set up in such a way to support long games and if it were not for Flanders, I would still be several decades away from having access to advanced buildings. While I only played 190 turns, I did have to be very careful about how I spent my money and ensure ample investment into economic buildings so as to support my growing army. Nevertheless, I feel that some high tier troops can be reached far too quickly. I had access to feudal troops in nearly half my provinces and by turn 200, I would likely have access to royal troops in at least one of them, if not more. As such, I would like to propose that higher tier military buildings either cost more or take longer to build.

It is here that I also stumbled upon the only bug in my campaign. Feudal champions only take 160 florins to build, but that should be 1600, guessing from their cost in the custom battle's unit selection screen.

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In conclusion, Redux is the definitive medieval TW and if I return one day to continue the campaign, I will be looking forward to a very interesting fight.

I would also like to thanks Axalon for providing modding tips and uploading an otherwise lost modding tool.

[yellowberry]

Can someone post download link for Redux Mod? I have serious problems with my PC using W7 64-bit. I'm unable to run Medieval:TW, it crashes right before main menu (I can only hear the sound when menu should appear). I want to install XL + Tiberius like on my XP 32-bit rig, but I heard that Redux works well on W7 and fixes a lot of bugs.

[Flinn]

Can someone post download link for Redux Mod? I have serious problems with my PC using W7 64-bit. I'm unable to run Medieval:TW, it crashes right before main menu (I can only hear the sound when menu should appear). I want to install XL + Tiberius like on my XP 32-bit rig, but I heard that Redux works well on W7 and fixes a lot of bugs.

if you check the OP it says that the download links are pending, so soon they should be updated, just keep an eye here

[Axalon]

Hello everyone, and thanks to Respenus for his post and input here.... BTW, feel free to do more of the same, if you like folks....

Anyhow, some comments due to Respenus post... For starters, each campaign is (typically) highly individual, even if we do play the same faction all over again. This trait in Redux has been confirmed over and over again. Now, it is not unheard of that - at start up - there is a lasting peace and extensive alliances between factions, but that never lasts. I think a more common scenario is that various factions (but not necessarily all) begins fighting somehow long before 100 turns have passed.

Frequent examples of such AI-factions fighting are Portugal vs. Spain or the Moors. Lombardy vs. Burgundy and/or Italy. Saracens vs. Byzantium or the Moors etc. etc. As for France, usually they do war with other factions before 100 turns - traditionally the foes are England, Burgundy and/or Aragon from what I can tell, but obviously other factions are possible too, the HRE or Lombards for instance. It is very hard to be universal and also accurate about this stuff. As to illustrate the diversity of AI-twists and turns of RX-campaigns, I will repost a picture from post 401, relevant to all this (below)...

Other comments...

• Feudal champions cost 150 florins and little else. That is the default design I created and if we use the default unit-size that is the value we get (regardless of version). Changing unit-size (large or max, for instance) may also possibly change the unit cost for the relevant troop in question. I see little other way how they could or would cost 160 or even 1600 florins...
  
  
• AI-units... Each campaign varies much in these regards as well, and it differs from faction to faction also. Byzantium is probably the only regular exception to all this - under AI-management - as they do have a tendency to not use the excellent troops available but instead prefers to (waste their cash to) bribe rebel-armies and get troops that way (this can not be changed, as long as they are allowed to use regular emissaries). Overall, that is typically bad news for Byzantium, long term, as most of such units are usually sub par to most other units, that other factions builds. All catholic faction usually do try to build serious troops as technology, opportunity and cash permits. The better troop, the more inclined the AI is to build it - usually anyways. There are always examples here and there that stray from all this, but I have seen too many royal infantry, feudal knights and heavy Muslim cavalry-formations etc. etc. in my day to believe otherwise. Anyhow, the troops in circulation in Redux - this regardless of circumstances - are still virtual light-years ahead of the typical peasant-feast of the raw game - even low tier troops in Redux are still much more dangerous to face anywhere then yet another horde of peasants. We should not forget that, as this stuff are discussed here (or elsewhere)...
  
  
• AI-economy... As with most other things in RX-campaigns, this too, differs one RX-campaign to the next (much in contrast to the raw MTW). This goes for factions as well. The easiest way to confirm this is to track the ever shifting domination of various factions within each RX-campaign - it changes over and over. That would not be possible if the economy did not function at decent levels somehow for every such dominating power/faction... Again lock at image above, it illustrates/indicates this reality fairly well...
  
  
• Most things about siege battles are indeed hardcoded and there are no actual parameters that is possible to change or influence the AI in that circumstance. It is possible to change "hitpoints" of walls and gates etc, but little else. All the same, the real problem of poor AI-performance remains regardless of all that. That's the very thing that really would need a work-over, and its not possible... As for Redux, the hitpoints of walls - and most other things too - have been boosted significantly already compared to raw MTW. And, siege-engines do more damage too, if memory serves (it would be easy to check).
  
  
• Lastly... I agree with the statement that battle is the place where Redux really shines and stands apart from the rest. Redux always have had (due to my personal preference) a heavy focus on diverse and brutal combat - more so then most things done for TW - and it shows. I think....

If I missed something on all this, by all means remind me.

- A

[HUtH]

Hi Axalon and fellow players

Thanks to Stazi from totalwar.org I get the download link from this thread (thx to Belcor) and could try this mod once again. Last time was few years ago and I had bounced off because of totally different approach in comparison to other mods(mainly big historical or small native polishing) and totalwar gameplay itself.
Now I have the will to give this mod's features a green light, but anyway I have some questions:
1. I can't get what's going on with portraits. I should play with the grey portraits and just change to colored ones only when I want this with some general? But i'd like to have fancy portraits from the beginning. Is there some quick and easy way to change all the numbered placeholders to the fancy colored portraits? Or can I just copy the original portraits? Since muslim are native..
2. I supposed this is the design to have provinces stripped of everything in the beginning so they are harder to keep at the early stage of campaign(RX classic)... eg. it's ok for Hungary to be empty? It is just so unintuitive for a history-based player. Also that Hungarians are based on Slavic units, but whatever.
3. What unit size should I choose? Default(and other one-turn recruitment) or Huge(2 turns)?
4. Achievements mode - is it legit or just a leftover from native?
5. What year is campaign ending? (probably very lame question )
6. I've just played 10 turns as Poland, so almost nothing. Are there some heroes recruitable at some periods like in native? Is it balanced or England have a big handicap with them like in native?

Well, I must say that this mod in strategic mode seems to me like some old Civ or RTSes like AoE or Rise of Nations with the stages of building, clear bunus percentages, balancing, empty map at the beginning etc. So different from totalwar historical narrative gameplay.

[Cyprian2]

Hi again, HUtH. Speaking as a veteran Redux player (since the early days), I'll try to answer some of your questions.

1) The “helmet-head” portraits are basically placeholders which can be manually swapped using the unit cards provided in the “Redux Bonus Materials” folder and matching the numbers on the character portraits. Yeah, it’s a bit fiddly, but does allow you to customize your kings and generals. I have a working set of unit cards that I simply copy and paste into campmap/Portraits each time I reinstall Redux. I’ve also mixed some of the emissary and Pagan priest portraits with those of generals — which gives more variety, in my opinion.
Alternately, if you don’t like the portraits created by Axalon, you could always copy-paste the vanilla portraits. Personally, though, I find that the “kill ‘em all” expressions on the faces of Axalon’s cards match the mood of the mod pretty well. As for the Muslims, I think I recall Axalon saying that unique portraits are planned for a future release, but don’t quote me.

2) When you say “provinces stripped of everything” you are referring to the “RX-supremacy” mode, aren’t you? Yes, Hungary starts as a rebel province with no buildings, so it becomes a bit of a power vacuum. As for historicity, I've always appreciated that this mod completely detaches itself from attempts at pure historical accuracy. Don't get me wrong: I love history, but I believe Axalon has always chosen to focus on gameplay. I like to think of it as a weird “alternate history” version of Europe and the Middle East, or as Axalon has said “a beautiful anachronism” which still somehow manages to feel “true” to the spirit of the age.

3) Unit size is your preference, but I think it was designed with default in mind; otherwise the various one-man units are completely negated.

4) Achievements do come into play, but not till much later in the campaign, as they are left-over from the vanilla dating system.

5) Campaign ends in 1260, and believe me, it doesn’t give you much time to deal with the Lithuanian spawn that Golden Horde has become. As long as Lithuania still exists as a faction, they will get a massive horde in 1231. Not sure what would happen if the player were Lithuania, though…

6) Poland is one of the hardest (and hence one of my favourite) factions to play. In the hands of the AI, they are fairly doomed. However, a clever early game defensive strategy will ensure your provinces get rich from trade and agriculture, and your armies have some of the best defensive units around. They have a great mix of slavic and feudal unit types. And dem slavic bowmen!

Keep playing, and you will be rewarded with great challenges. The peacetime lull at the beginning of the campaign is truly misleading. Around turn sixty, you will start to feel the burn, believe me.

[HUtH]

1. Well, I'll mix everything then... It'd just be convenient to have some premade portrait packs for lazy types..
2. Pretty sure I started Classic campaing, and many provinces are empty or almost empty. Interesting for gameplay, not much for historical taste. I need to adapt. I loaded Supremacy once, and that's so arcade-hardcore
3. Ah, one-man units! Forgot about them.
4. Maybe I will try that in another campaign.
5. That's good to know, I'd have thought that's a bug.
6. I always choose Poland first time playing, because I'm curious how it's portrayed, though generally I like to play with nations with safer position. BTW I'm totally lost with that whole new unit rooste but I like the design.

Thanks for answer, learned a lot!

[scoutception]

I'm getting an error when I try to start this mod. "Unknown faction label used to indicate building advantage: column 13, row 23 FN_PAPIST" I made sure to use a clean install, and I installed the VI upgrade and the Unipatch as well.

[Axalon]

Hello everyone - maybe I can comment on the previous posts from Huth later on, if time allows. No doubt there are plenty of babble/post-worthy stuff in his remarks and questions, from what I can tell. Also thanks to Cyp for stepping up and helping out/assisting here, it makes this a better place... Anyhow... Scoutception what version of MTW are you using? V.1.1? Or V.2.01?

- A

[scoutception]

I'm using the steam version, so V.2.01.

[Axalon]

Very, very strange...

In my experience it should not even be possible for a V.2.01-engine to generate a "FN_Papist"-error message. It should only be capable of creating a "Papist"-error message. Assuming that we are talking about the engine-versions that Redux actually supports. Now, the "FN_Papist" error-message derives from the MTW-engine protesting that it is required/expected/ordered to run what is V.2.01-formated files (Redux-files) while the engine is something else - other then V.2.01 (and then dependent on another format and/or distinctions within the files).

Alright, I suggest you re-install everything from scratch. Also, make very sure you install everything in proper order, and only basic Redux + the Redux VI/v.2.01-patch. Don't bother with the unipatch-files at this point - you can install that once you made sure/confirmed the basic (and upgraded) package do work for you (so start with basic Redux package + the VI-patch then). If things still don't work after that, there are only two-three possible explanations that I can dream up, that would also somehow still explain all this...


A). Human error of some kind (install screw up basically. However I cant imagine how it would be possible without a V.1.1-engine considering the reported error-message).

B). Creative assembly have secretly upgraded the game-engine - and the file-format somehow for " CRUSADER_BUILD_PROD13" - which is the file causing the error here... As far as I can tell...

C). A combination of A and B, somehow...

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If things still don't work out for you - that is - after the re-install and all that jazz... Then take a damn screen of the error-message (Jpeg or Png - it does not matter), post it here (or send it to me via PM - as to totally exclude any margins for ANY possible misunderstandings, AND then you also send me/attach some genuine/official certified Steam-files for original MTW, as delivered/presented via Steam. You can also send it to me via E-mail directly, if preferred, its usually faster that way, although dropping a post/note here saying/showing you sent me an E-mail might very well speed up my response-time somewhat. Your call). Anyhow, I would (then) want to examine the "CRUSADERS_UNIT_PROD11.TXT"-file and the "CRUSADER_BUILD_PROD13.TXT"-files as provided via Steam, to see if CA have made some or any undeclared changes in the file-structure. If they have, it could, and would, explain all things, so far...

Scoutception, the ball is yours...

- A

[scoutception]

Well, sent you a PM about my attempt. Anyway, the files you wanted will be attached here. Hopefully this won't be a problem other users of this mod will run into. In any case, good luck.CRUSADERS_UNIT_PROD11.TXTCRUSADER_BUILD_PROD13.TXT

[Axalon]

Alright, I have sent a PM back to you Scoutception and hopefully that will be enough to resolve your problem with Redux (Feel free to send me further PMs on it, if you like. As suspected, the files you attached here was a dead end. Thanks all the same for doing it). I have taken this as far as I can, having no Steam-copy to allowing me to retrace and replicate things. Thus it is high time we leave this matter and carry on with different and other things in this thread. Such as commenting on previous posts from Huth, Cyprian and so on. Maybe I should do that too, later on? Or the slightly fantastic fact that it is soon 8 years (8th Aug) since the first ever version of Redux was released to the public. Imagine that...

- A

[scoutception]

Alright, in case anyone else ends up having this issue, apparently putting the copy of Medieval: Total War that you want to install Redux to on your desktop instead of somewhere in your hard drive makes all the difference, and any errors you find about missing folders can be safely skipped.

[Axalon]

Great that things finally worked out for you (totally gratifying!)...

So scoutception... Now that you got Redux finally running, what faction have you decided to play? Any specific reasons for your selection, or did you just pic one faction at random? ...?... If you have any questions about whatever something, this is obviously the place to post 'em (or the Redux-area over at the Org-forum, of course. That works too, for all people so inclined).

***

Anyhow, as I was saying earlier... Its almost 8 years since Redux went public (8th Aug 2008), which means it has been 10 freaking years since I started working on this damn thing (Redux), and it means it have been 5 years since the contemporary RXB1000-versions hit the public (Mar 2011). Major releases almost every year since 2011 too (2015 being the exception, only released the 2nd unipatch that year). And, here I am planning to release RXB1006 in 2016 as well, continuing to polish things in Redux ever further, and getting rid of more bugs, errors, patches and hotfixes etc. Changing even more GFX, cleaning up units etc. etc. Yup, yet another version in the works folks... I can't seem to get enough of this thing....

- A