Venice Impregnable

[KhanMan]

First off, I love the work that has been done on this mod-I've tried out a number of different factions and found each of them to be enjoyable.

That said, I've encountered one glaring problem with the garrison of capitals system-Venice appears to be impregnable. For about 40 years there's been a Crusade against Venice, with every Catholic faction on the map sending armies. Each time Venice is besieged, the script activates, filling the garrison. Unfortunately, Venice can only be attacked by one army at a time, with only one army in support. As a result, Venice in my game is down to it's capital, but no amount of heavy troops can take the city, due to space issues. I'm playing with a very advanced Sicily, so I have plenty of good infantry and crossbowmen, but nothing seems to beat the Venician garrison.

Is there a way around this? It's getting a bit annoying, since the crusade doesn't seem to end until the target falls (even lasting through 6 different popes), and Venice seems to be unbeatable. I've tried wearing it down with repeated attacks, but the garrison script keeps refilling the city with more high quality troops.

What am I missing?

Many thanks for any help, suggestions!
-KhanMan

PS. I love how the kings tend to die in packs-every time I see six announcements of dead rulers on the same turn I get a warm and fuzzy feeling deep down.

[maltesefalcon]

I suggest you stave them out and let them attack you, draws them out and the use of Mongels and other anti horde equipment is always recommended.

As for Venice its one of its features being a itch to take

[KhanMan]

Maltesefalcon,

My main problem is that it isn't possible to get enough troops close to Venice to fight them. I have plenty of strong troops, but they are forced to approach single file, if you will.

The garrison gives Venice two full stacks of defenders, but only one stack of attackers can besiege at a time. No matter the type of troops, no matter how many I have in reserve lined up, the game forces me to attack with one stack at a time. I wouldn't mind that if attrition were an option, but the garrison script automatically replenishes after each assault.

-KhanMan

[MrChris]

hmmm I shall have a look in my game at this, in my England campaign Milan's only region is Venice and they have indeed held it for quite some time

it has typically been hard to attack because of the single bridge

but I hardly ever attack settlements if they have large stacks garrisonned, I will do the full length siege if thats the case

[KhanMan]

MrChris,

I agree that a full siege would be more effective. Sadly, because of the bridge, any besieging army can be beaten. It's kind of like the bad guys in a martial arts movie-they always attack one at a time.

-KhanMan

[maltesefalcon]

Ah

Well send in two armies

First army to destroy the defences and the second army consisting of heavy troops, yes it may be a massive waste of reasources, but Venice is a island city and requires alot of manpower to bring it down

[MrChris]

Jesus christ I see what you mean, marched my battle hardened stack that I used in the Americas and had to take on plenty of milanese stacks, got to Venice and it is very hemmed in, I decided to retreat rather than risk losing any of my experience units but yes it is indeed tough

but I like it that way, next time I will be able to cap it no problems, if I can siege the city then I will win no problems tbh, longbowmen destroy sally armies

[pwf224]

Even though this may be extremely annoying, historically Venice has some pretty sweet natural defenses such as being an island. If you've ever been there you'd notice right away that it would be hard to seige the city. My advice is seige and wait it out, and make sure you have another full stack behind you for the sally battle.

[Dave Scarface]

The garrison gives Venice two full stacks of defenders

Heres the actual garrison that spawns to defend Venice. The rest are men who were already in the settlment.

the game forces me to attack with one stack at a time.

Isn't it possible to attack Venice from the sea with another army at the same time? and lay siege to the settlement from the other side?

Dave

[zeuxis the mighty]

you could always siege them for a long time until the last turn before they fall and they sally out against you

[pwf224]

I checked out the attack by sea option last night and it looks like that should work, especially since you are sicily and I'm assuming you've built a fairly strong navy. If not, one of those mercenary cogs that spawn like crazy when you next to water should give you the ability to seige it with 2+ stacks with one on the bridge to watch your back. It looks like your problem is that the AI is actually building those stacks themselves, becuase the garrison is fairly weak in comparison to the 2 uber stacks you were talking about.

[maltesefalcon]

One thing i do notice with AI in this game, with there last settlement that seem to have massive armies (usually 2 to 3 stacks) worth just guarding and i always wonder where the hell do they get the money to afford the upkeep wouldn't they gone bankrupt or majority of those armies going rebel (people usually want to get paid unless they are conscripts but even then they can take so much)

Anyone got any ideas about that.

[Dave Scarface]

One thing i do notice with AI in this game, with there last settlement that seem to have massive armies (usually 2 to 3 stacks) worth just guarding and i always wonder where the hell do they get the money to afford the upkeep wouldn't they gone bankrupt or majority of those armies going rebel (people usually want to get paid unless they are conscripts but even then they can take so much)

This is one of the things I love most about Lusteds CAI. When an AI controlled faction gets reduced down to its last few settlements it goes into a survival mode. In vanilla the AI would still send out its armies to attack somewhere else, leaving its final settlement undefended.. But in this mod you will see a full stack sitting in their waiting for any attacks. Which is great, the AI has far more of a chance beating you when it is defending its own walls with a large army. About how they can afford to have multiple stacks? well there is a debt script as well as the money script, incase the AI should go into the red. Also it is possible that the faction could have a lot of money left over in reserve, but this may dwindle. I could change this, but would you really prefer an AI controlled faction to roll over when it has one settlement left, go bankrupt, and turn rebel?

Dave

[maltesefalcon]

you can land troops on the beach of the island

[THARN]

This is one of the things I love most about Lusteds CAI. When an AI controlled faction gets reduced down to its last few settlements it goes into a survival mode. In vanilla the AI would still send out its armies to attack somewhere else, leaving its final settlement undefended.. But in this mod you will see a full stack sitting in their waiting for any attacks. Which is great, the AI has far more of a chance beating you when it is defending its own walls with a large army. About how they can afford to have multiple stacks? well there is a debt script as well as the money script, incase the AI should go into the red. Also it is possible that the faction could have a lot of money left over in reserve, but this may dwindle. I could change this, but would you really prefer an AI controlled faction to roll over when it has one settlement left, go bankrupt, and turn rebel?

Dave

I like the idea behind the 'survival mode' but its seems like the AI have too many armies when they are down to a few settlements. Just too many- It makes it very difficult to move on because you find yourself having to garrison your own cities 2 fold because the enemy that you've put a hurtin on keeps coming back at you. Before long your bankrupt and at war with more factions than you can handle.
I have started to take settlements early and strip them bare and give them away to factions that would usually war with me. this does two things- it keeps me in good standing and also puts these factions in positions on the map that just cause them to get into wars they would not normally get into. So far its allowed me to stay above water.

[man]

press ' or # and type in rogan into an army that is beseiging it u will see what i mean when u try it