Byzantium Tips

[XICenturionIX]

Hello guys, I am relatively new to Stainless Steel, and I was hoping to get some tips on playing with Byzantium. I understand that since they're between Europe, Asia, and Africa, their wealth is tempting to outside powers. I was just curious if anyone had any tips on who I should eliminate first? I find that fighting the Turks means fighting the Fatimid Caliphate, because they always seem to form some kind of military alliance when I declare war on either one of the two aforementioned factions. Should I perhaps make an alliance with them and move northward against the Hungarians, Poles, Kievan-Rus, and Novgorod, or perhaps I should look westward across the Adriatic, towards the Italian peninsula? Any tips or hints is welcome. Thank you!

[Barser]

if you play early campaign you should take as many rebel settlements as possible and build up your economy.
then go whereever you feel like it.

if it is late campaign then go east against the turks
try to get som alliences before the first attack though.

good luck.

[shenryyr]

As barser said, go for the rebel settlements first. Starting out so large, you have a huge advantage over everyone else -- try to make peace quickly and capture available settlements with your many small armies. You can probably even buy some neighboring settlements from the Turks.

Also, after the initial rush and things have settled down, convert your castles to cities to make more money -- particularly the islands Rhodes and Nicosia, and Benghazi assuming you grab that. Money gives you whatever options you want - you can be militaristic and conquer everyone, or you can focus on building your cities and recruiting a few very good units to replace lots of disbanded weak units.

If you want to go to war, get a good alliance with someone else who usually goes to war with the faction you're targeting, /before/ you begin the war. Like, lets say you want to attack Hungary and Venice, then get a marriage alliance with the HRE. They will back you forever because they usually don't like Venice or Hungary anyway. Or if you want to war with the turks, get alliances with the Kwarezm and Fatimids first. Realize however that moslem factions will turn on you instantly if a jihad is called to Constantinople, or Iconium(if you take that from the turks), or any of the regions in the Levant.

[themoob]

I'd say aim for the Italian peninsula.

Having Constantinople, Venice and Genoa would give you more money than you can poke a stick at, plus you would have almost entire control of the Mediterranean from there.

[RomaVictor6969]

i agree you should try an retake the Italian Peninsula hell if anybody should own it its you....you are the eastern Roman empire and Italy should always be in the hands of the true Romans...

[ssmarine]

Yeah the Med belongs to the Romans that should be your biggest goal. Dominate the Mediteranean and the money from sea trade will be ridiculous. You have to fight on alot of fronts in the late game so be ready for that.
I used the basic militia forces in each town with a trebizond archer unit..the key for my defense was using large roving armies of horse archers and cavalry to help defend each front. That way if your attacked at any of your settlements you have a huge reinforcement force a turn away. Oh yeah and the Egyptians seemed to be obsessed with taking Cyprus on my campaign.

[strife1013]

you'll have enough money to fund tons of armies!

[XICenturionIX]

Very well, I shall experiment around between war with the Turks or the Hungarian/Venetian's. By the way, a little off topic, but could anyone tell me if I should just go ahead and make all taxes low in every province from the start so they can grow or should I heavily tax until I build a stable economy?

[shenryyr]

I usually do the low taxes route to build the cities fast(usually without any governors since they turn sour at not being in battles) -- but either way should be fine. Realize that as the byzantines, you are in charge of the largest empire with a strong economic base and plenty of potential. It really is your opportunity to do whatever you want with the game, not like Lithuania or the Knights Templar where you have to fight everyone to survive.

[XICenturionIX]

Another question I have refers to castles. In the vanilla version of M2TW, I built farms for my castles, however, I never really gave it much thought if there was a point for farm building in castles. Should I continue building farms for my castles in SS or invest my gold towards something else?

[FriendoftheDork]

Another question I have refers to castles. In the vanilla version of M2TW, I built farms for my castles, however, I never really gave it much thought if there was a point for farm building in castles. Should I continue building farms for my castles in SS or invest my gold towards something else?

Farms in castles are definiely worth it, to get access to your high-tier units. You don't need to build up all the way in all your castles, but at least the important ones such as the one in Greece and possibly one south of Nicea. The extra income pays off in the long run, and being able to build fortresses and citadels really makes a difference.

[NE_Passat'n]

ally with the north neighbors if you can, which will allow you to focus on turkey, which won't upset the pope as much

[sirfiggin]

in either campaign, go against the turks early. Secure Greece, try to take Sofia and Scopia before Hungary, and ally with them, as well as the Russian states, Orthodox need to stick together. With a secure base in Greece and the west coast of anatolia, prepare for a massive expedition against the Seljuks. It may be dishonorable, but if you want to survive the muslim onslaught, it is necessary to reach the cities of Iconium and Ankara within 5-10 turns of declaring war, once they are taken, push the turks back to Kutais and stop. Now, you have a choice, in the late campaign, the Kingdom of Jerusalem will be still in force (normally), so you can either wait for Egypt to crush them, fight around them to take the Nile delta, or really upset the Catholics and plow straight through them.In the Early campaign, the choice is easier, as the Templars are weaker and may have already been overwhelmed, while the Fatamids are still to underdeveloped to produce powerful armies.The War in Syria and Egypt is long, and tough, as her armies are weak but also very large, and numerous. Combine your superior cavalry (missile and melee) with strong generals and spearmen to crush them. Once egypt is gone and the ERE whole again, turn your sights on Italy....the funniest thing ever was when the Pope attacked me...their were Catholic corpses all over the place!

[XICenturionIX]

Though it is my option, could anyone recommend which they like better? Early or Late Era? With the Byzantines, that is.

[King Sama]

It may be dishonorable, but if you want to survive the muslim onslaught, it is necessary to reach the cities of Iconium and Ankara within 5-10 turns of declaring war, once they are taken, push the turks back to Kutais and stop.

Why not just attack the two settlements directly. Isnt that how you would start the war?

[todorp]

I enjoy playing Byzantium. It is good fun. Only I have to play very long until I get the fire throwers. OMG they are cool. My plan which works for my stile is:
1. Rase the taxes to the maximum the population can bear. I do it every turn. The tax will be the main line of revenue on the balance sheet for the first hundreds turns.
2. Send 2 diplomats (one in Europe and one in Asia) to sign trade agreements, alliances and sell maps. Sometime to sign an alliance I have to offer $500 bribe, but I get them back when I sell the maps.
2. Upgrade all the churches to keep the Orthodox religion and the order high. Then keep building order buildings. The
3. Race fast to capture the rebel towns and castles. I mean race. Use and produce as little troops as possible, to keep the spending low and not to suffocate the economy.
4. As soon as the treasury permits I convert all the castles on the sea shores to towns. Do the same for the castles which have more than 5 or 6 land trade links, e.g. Sofia has 7 land trade links and as a town produces a juicy trace income of about $350 per trade link.
5. Make all the merchants I can and send them far far away. Initially they won’t make much money, but will trigger Merchant Gilds. In the towns build only Merchant Gilds, because they raise your trade income.
6. When finished with #4, attack and finish only one faction at a time. I first conquer the Seljuk’s and then the other Muslim factions, because sooner or latter they will declare a Jihad on Constantinople, when the Catholic factions normally keep the peace.

[Darviathar]

in either campaign, go against the turks early. Secure Greece, try to take Sofia and Scopia before Hungary, and ally with them, as well as the Russian states, Orthodox need to stick together. With a secure base in Greece and the west coast of anatolia, prepare for a massive expedition against the Seljuks. It may be dishonorable, but if you want to survive the muslim onslaught, it is necessary to reach the cities of Iconium and Ankara within 5-10 turns of declaring war, once they are taken, push the turks back to Kutais and stop. Now, you have a choice, in the late campaign, the Kingdom of Jerusalem will be still in force (normally), so you can either wait for Egypt to crush them, fight around them to take the Nile delta, or really upset the Catholics and plow straight through them.In the Early campaign, the choice is easier, as the Templars are weaker and may have already been overwhelmed, while the Fatamids are still to underdeveloped to produce powerful armies.The War in Syria and Egypt is long, and tough, as her armies are weak but also very large, and numerous. Combine your superior cavalry (missile and melee) with strong generals and spearmen to crush them. Once egypt is gone and the ERE whole again, turn your sights on Italy....the funniest thing ever was when the Pope attacked me...their were Catholic corpses all over the place!

Your biggest threat as Byzantium is the jihad. A jihad featuring 4 muslim factions can be pretty tough on Constantinople. Hungary will usually leave you alone if you get an early alliance. I left Scopia and Sofia for them in my latest game, and because the neutral stacks in those two castles aren't pushovers, it took them a while to get through them. They usually fight against Poland and Venice, which helps you. Venice will stab you in the back regardless of what you leave for them. If you get lucky, the HRE is strong and will threaten them, but in my current game, HRE has too much on its hands, Genoa is a vassal of the Papacy, and Venice is really a PITA while I try to deal with jihads. Defend Thessalonica well, but don't worry about Durazzo. It is so small that its really not worth trying to build up. Let them have it. I've never had them attack Corinth or Athens. Taking Ankara and Iconium early really hurts the Turks, and taking Caesarea should flat-out nullify them. To the guys suggesting you go west...I just don't agree with this. The Turks ARE going to attack you, because there is no one else for them to fight after the pitiful Templars are routed. I've never seen the Turks and Egyptians fight, so that means the Egyptians are likely to come after you as well. If you've declared war on the Italian-area catholic powers (especially the Papal States) you are going to be fighting a major two-front war that is going to put you in very dire straits. My advice is to concentrate on recapturing the historical parts of the Eastern Roman Empire before you try to salvage the west again. There are so many factions operating in the west that there is a good chance that they'll still be fragmented by the time you move into the area, but if you leave the Turks and Egyptians alone, they will be super powers. Not to mention the Kwarezmians, who are absolutely overpowered and can be lethal on jihads.

[Mauzeer]

Agree with Darviathar. make alliance with Hungary, at least one ortodox faction, and KEEP POPE HAPPY with alliance and gifts from time to time, so
you wont become target from crusade(s). deal with turks first, pushed them out of asia minor. afterwards you can choose to attack Fatimids (which i do)
or focus on Italy (watch carfully diplomacy and attack catholic faction which
is in war with many other catholic factions coz its probably excummunicated)

good luck,

[Shoryn]

In my Byz campaign, I did as following (I play on VH/VH without submods) :

- Took as many rebel settlements as possible (Crete, west of turkey, west and south of greece but left Scopia and Sofia to Hungary)
- Alliance with Hungary (I never backstabbed them and they did the same, so the north front is ever safe)
- Build up my economy by converting most Castles into Cities (I just kept Corinth and Adrianople as Castles)
- Waited for a Jihad in Constantinople. Beaten the turks, fatimids, kwarizmian and Moors with 2 full stacks of Generals/Byz Lancers/Dis. Byz lancers/Trebizond Archers and some trebuchets.
- Counterattacking the turks by taking Ankara, Iconium and Isparta
- Fatimids hold attacking me with full stacks until I rush their troops-empty meditarrean commercial cities (Alexandria, Cairo, etc...). Now they are weak and waiting for me to invade them, especially in holy lands
- Sicily attacked me in northwest of Greece. I bribed their armies and counterattacked them in south of Italy (Palermo, Syracuse, Naples, etc)

Now I have 1 full stack of elite troops guarding the east front, based in Iconium; 1 full stack of elite troops rushing ports cities in south of Mediterranean Sea, and 2 full stacks of elite troops attacking the rest of Sicilian forces.

All that with a 15000 income by turn (40000 without troops since I pay 25000 for upkeep), so I'm relatively wealthy. After having completely beaten the Sicilians I think I'll attack Fatimids in Holy lands and take as many mediterranean ports as possible.

BTW, with the Jihad on Constantinople my reputation kept reducing (to Very Unthrustworthy) so I kept releasing prisoners and made huge gift to the pope. I'm Very Reliable now, it took ~20-30 turns.
Remember one thing : Alliance with muslim faction is useless since you'll get a Jihad in Constantinople.

[XICenturionIX]

In my current game, the Templars are wiping the Turks up and down the Levant and the eastern half of Turkey, snatching their capital in the east while I hold Iconium, Ankara, and Caesarea in the west. Currently, the Fatimid Caliphate is preoccupied with Polish and Danish crusaders, so I will take this opportunity to further my campaigns in the east, taking more Turkish settlements until the Templars and I wipe them out. And if our military alliance holds, I would like to move on to Nile Delta, snatching both Alexandria and Cairo, then move on to capture currently Fatimid-controlled Jerusalem.