-- Preview of Elves --

[christof139]

Yes!! Feanor, Warden of the Toilet Door. Greedy Elfses not want to share anything with poor Melkor.

[Caml3]

Feanor started everything!

Fo rizzle. Arrogant son of a biscuit-eater.

[Beregond]

I did not sympathize Dwarves in the case with Nauglamir,but I have no pity for Thingol as well.
I have much more pity for Fingolfin,for land of Hithlum,for the whole Gondolin. Thingol just sat hidden within the walls of Melian and did nothing,he didn't participate in the War while others fought and died...And it was his arrogance that bring him the end,and utterly his fault

[Mithrandir]

I have much more pity for Fingolfin,for land of Hithlum,for the whole Gondolin.

Maeglin...

[Elfhelm]

Maeglin...

This Elf should not be named!!! What of poor Dior

[smoesville]

In truth Fëanor got tricked by Morgoth... I feel bad for him because he died without avenging his father. Although i would say maybe things would have been worse for the elves if he had survived. He was quite rash and that is why he died.

[Varjon]

There are so many things Fëanor could have achieved if Melkor hadn't tricked him.

[Eriagon]

Only Manwë could imagine what he would be capable of.

[Fenix_120]

Only Manwë could imagine what he would be capable of.

Yeah, like he could have forged to worlds most comfortable pair of underwear, or the worlds most combustible if he still went a little nutty.

[Elfhelm]

Much woe begotten by the sons of Feanor! without their stubborn pride much may yet still have endured! But for the Doom of Mandos in which the fate and secrets of all things doth dwell!

Arise Eorlingas now is the dawn of man! Iff you muster now maybe when the fightin starts you shall be ready and strong! The time for war is almost upon us!

[Jean=A=Luc]

Much woe begotten by the sons of Feanor! without their stubborn pride much may yet still have endured! But for the Doom of Mandos in which the fate and secrets of all things doth dwell!

Nothing would have endured without the Noldor despite what Feanor's sons did.

[Elfhelm]

Time and time again the sons of Feanor commited kinslaying and that didn't stop at males! Without the sons of Feanor so many heroic folk would have prospered and in the end their treachery all but saw Morgoth succeed! But for Earendils plea to the Valar and the intervention of the uber boys!... But its the root of all Tolkiens history and an epic tale for sure.....The Silmarillions 6 films at least!

[christof139]

Yeah, the Noldor are a personification of revenge and greed and betrayal that is present in the human race. They initially went against the wishes of the Valar and also took action against their fellow Elves. It is as Elfhelm states.

The fact that Melkor stole the Silmarils and killed Frinwe, Feanor's father, was not enough to set the Valar in motion since the Simarils were simply jewels, even though they contained the light of the Two Trees, and the Valar had asked Finwe to give them the Silmarils after Melkor destroyed the Two Trees so they, the Valar, could restore the Two Tress. However, Finwe refused, out of greed I guess, and did not give the Silmarils to the Valar. If Finwe had given the Silmarils to the Valar Melkor may have been not able to steal them and Finwe would most likely not have been killed by Melkor.

The Noldor are a personification and mirror image of the human race. Imperfect, self-centered and willed, and greedy. By their initiation of the Kin Slaying and their exodus from Valinor, and many subsequent acts of deciet and betrayl, thay brought the ban of Manwe and the Valar upon them and were forbidden to retutn to Valinor. It took many centuries before the Ban was lifted, and only through repentence and great acts against the enemy Morgoth was the ban lifted and the Noldor forgiven.

[LOTRKnowItAll]

Hmm nice elves though I think that perhaps more AoR units could be added because the elves of the various lands were considerably different, seeing as technically they weren't even all of the same race.

[Jean=A=Luc]

Without Noldor Melkor would have conquered ME in the 1st age, there was no one who could effectively oppose him.

[christof139]

Without the Noldor acting as they did, many fellow Elves and men who not have died, and the Valar may have eventually taken matters into their own hands again and captured Melkor and imprisoned him again without the problems and waste of lives that the Noldor caused.

[Jean=A=Luc]

Without the Noldor acting as they did, many fellow Elves and men who not have died, and the Valar may have eventually taken matters into their own hands again and captured Melkor and imprisoned him again without the problems and waste of lives that the Noldor caused.

What are you talking about, the Valar did nothing. When Melkor destroyed the trees and killed Finwe they refused to lift a finger. Without Noldor Melkor would have easily slaughtered the Men and Sindar of ME in the 1st age.

The kinslaying of Alqualonde, though unfortunate, had no impact on the ME peoples' ability to resisst Melkor simply becasue those Teleri didn't live in ME. On the other hand, almost immediately upon arriving to ME the Noldor under Feanor almost completely annihilated Melkor's army that he had prepared for the conquest of ME.

The later two kinslayings involved a refuge camp (hardly a military stronghold) and the already ravaged/destroyed Doriath. Except for that Noldor provided a living shield against Melkor delaying him for thousands of years in Beleriand, Hitlum, Nargothrond, Gondolin etc.

And who are these "men" who would have survived if it wasn't for Noldor? They never conducted any mass killing of humans. They were betrayed by them though.

Noldor contribution to the defense of ME heavily outweighed their crimes, crimes which they payed for continualy. The very reason why Valar pardoned them in the end was because the Noldor did so much to protect ME, not because they contributed to its downfall.

[christof139]

What are you talking about!??! The Valar punished the Noldor for not listening to the Valar as they should have and for they're evil acts such as the Kin Slaying by banning them from Valinor.

The Valar did nothing because Finwe previously did not give them the Simarils as they asked him to do. So, Finwe was being a greedy jerk and brought doom upon himself and his people. Then, after the Noldor committed the Kin Slaying and left Valinor against the wishes of Manwe, the Valar banned these evil doing Noldor from Valinor and let them suffer for awhile, several hundred years, before the Valar decided to aid the Elves and Edain of ME at Earendil's request.

What does it matter if the Noldor slew fellow Elves in a fortress, city, town, field, forest, or camp!!??!! The pont is that were slaying fellow Elves out of greed and acarice etc. and were wrong for doing so, and that is why the Valar were very angry with them.

Yes, the Valar pardoned the Noldor in the end because many of the Noldor redeemed themselves through good acts and because of Earendil's pleas for help and because the Valar decided the Noldor had suffered enough of the doom and evil they brought upon themselves in the begginning.

[sithlord447]

What are you talking about!??! The Valar punished the Noldor for not listening to the Valar as they should have and for they're evil acts such as the Kin Slaying by banning them from Valinor.

The Valar did nothing because Finwe previously did not give them the Simarils as they asked him to do. So, Finwe was being a greedy jerk and brought doom upon himself and his people. Then, after the Noldor committed the Kin Slaying and left Valinor against the wishes of Manwe, the Valar banned these evil doing Noldor from Valinor and let them suffer for awhile, several hundred years, before the Valar decided to aid the Elves and Edain of ME at Earendil's request.

What does it matter if the Noldor slew fellow Elves in a fortress, city, town, field, forest, or camp!!??!! The pont is that were slaying fellow Elves out of greed and acarice etc. and were wrong for doing so, and that is why the Valar were very angry with them.

Yes, the Valar pardoned the Noldor in the end because many of the Noldor redeemed themselves through good acts and because of Earendil's pleas for help and because the Valar decided the Noldor had suffered enough of the doom and evil they brought upon themselves in the begginning.

i must say that if the noldor had just stayed in valinor the valar would have done something as i don't thing the would sit idely by while the sindarian elves are wiped of the face of the earth and all men come in to middle earth and would know nothing of the valar just morgoroth pain and suffering

[christof139]

i must say that if the noldor had just stayed in valinor the valar would have done something as i don't thing the would sit idely by while the sindarian elves are wiped of the face of the earth and all men come in to middle earth and would know nothing of the valar just morgoroth pain and suffering

Exactly. The Valar would have eventually moved against Melkor again.