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Thread: Faction - Ottoman Empire

  1. #121

    Default Re: Faction - Ottoman Empire

    You can check my museum tours Matko for any further info and i was there and unfortunately there were no any specific writing about those lances.

    Harbiye Army Museum Topic:
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=134939

    Topkapı Palace Museum Topic:
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=139193
    Last edited by Little Legionaire; January 31, 2008 at 11:14 AM.

  2. #122

    Default Re: Faction - Ottoman Empire

    Great stuff bro!!!
    The House of Wilpuri ~ Proud Patron of: The Noble Lord & Sumskilz


  3. #123
    Matthæus's Avatar Knez Bribirski
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    Default Re: Faction - Ottoman Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by Little Legionaire View Post
    You can check my museum tours Matko for any further info and i was there and unfortunately there were no any specific writing about those lances.

    Harbiye Army Museum Topic:
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=134939

    Topkapı Palace Museum Topic:
    http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=139193

    can I assume these are cavalry lances ? since ottomans didn't use pikemen so they are not infantry pikes. they are like 4 m long, right ? just the size of ottoman cavalry lance.
    http://img246.imageshack.us/my.php?i...eleg073kz9.jpg
    http://img91.imageshack.us/my.php?im...eleg091lb9.jpg
    http://img263.imageshack.us/my.php?i...eleg198wt1.jpg
    actually that metal sphere makes perfect sense as it makes that lance does not penetrate too deep into victims flesh and then break.

  4. #124

    Default Re: Faction - Ottoman Empire

    Tsar@
    Thx mate hope you enjoyed

    Matko@
    I think those metal balls way similar usage of Roman Pilum balls. May be a small diagram helps to get clear our point. Weight of the ball and spearhead combines a greater effect of impact on victim.

    It simply holds the impact energy absorbs it. Sounds like AP effect on any surface. You hit the target by spearhead and ball hold and lock the created energy and wont let it go.

    http://www.larp.com/legioxx/pilum.html

    Somewhere around the mid- or late first century AD, the weighted pilum shows up. None have been found by archeologists, yet, but what we see in artwork is a regular tanged pilum with a ball behind the junction block. We are guessing that this is a lead weight, to add penetration power to the weapon since it had been getting progressively lighter over the years. The weight does not form part of the actual joint between iron and wood but is just below the joint. It might have been held in place by a cord wrapping on the wood below it, but there could easily have been some sort of nail or rivet holding it in place. Since the wood shaft was under an inch thick by that time, the weight didn't have to be very big, maybe tennis-ball sized or less. Though there is a tombstone from the late 2nd or early 3rd century that shows a pilum with TWO weights...
    Last edited by Little Legionaire; January 31, 2008 at 02:12 PM.

  5. #125
    nnnm's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Faction - Ottoman Empire

    those spears with balls are heavy lances in eastern style. such weapon made for charging with cavalry only.when a cavalry charge each others rather than 50% of spear goes through someone body then it's stick there or it's break when he training to get it out, so the ball helps to make the harmful piece off the spear to make the damage only and the ball pushes the enemy off his horse what increases the damage. the other ones which don't have a ball they are probably Standard bearer or infantry pikes but not laces. lighter cavalry spear were much better in hand to hand combat with cavalry but their charge are less effective because they depend in the man power not the cavalry charge power.

    light spear
    http://img390.imageshack.us/my.php?i...boul514ve1.jpg
    lances [those in the medial with balls]
    http://img246.imageshack.us/my.php?i...eleg073kz9.jpg
    cheers



  6. #126
    Matthæus's Avatar Knez Bribirski
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    Default Re: Faction - Ottoman Empire

    question
    in this well known osprey illustration - what kind of shield does that yaya guy have ? this looks like simple medium-size round shield ( made of wood and leather).
    http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y11...n_warriors.jpg

    PS
    i made that cavalry lance. you will see screenshot when whole unit is done. phoenix is working on the unit skin.

  7. #127

    Default Re: Faction - Ottoman Empire

    I think it's a round shield Matko coz i've never seen any different shaped shields in my museum tourings. Just only round ones, metal covered and such... There were couple of different designs made by Turtle shell and Crocodile hide but they were Indian shields not Turkish or eastern referenced.

    Hope it helps.

  8. #128
    Matthæus's Avatar Knez Bribirski
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    Default Re: Faction - Ottoman Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by Little Legionaire View Post
    I think it's a round shield Matko coz i've never seen any different shaped shields in my museum tourings. Just only round ones, metal covered and such... There were couple of different designs made by Turtle shell and Crocodile hide but they were Indian shields not Turkish or eastern referenced.

    Hope it helps.
    so even poorer units like yayas had metal - covered shields ?
    yayas, will more or less, be tier1 ( "cannon fodder" ) unit in TTW.

  9. #129

    Default Re: Faction - Ottoman Empire

    I saw only metal covered shields Matko but there is a possibility of making metal shields by lower quality materials such Bronze and etc. Plus, this does not mean there were no leather covered shields. Coz there were some

    Some samples can be helpful for better understanding:

    Leather Covered


    Bronze Covered


    Iron or Steel Covered probably combined materials and highly decorated
    Last edited by Little Legionaire; February 02, 2008 at 07:37 AM.

  10. #130
    nnnm's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Faction - Ottoman Empire

    I think it's look like this
    http://img266.imageshack.us/my.php?i...boul578ui0.jpg
    and like those
    http://img529.imageshack.us/my.php?i...boul460wl1.jpg
    I should visit Istanbul one day
    Cheers



  11. #131

    Default Re: Faction - Ottoman Empire

    bronze material was very uncommon until late 16th-17th century.

  12. #132

    Default Re: Faction - Ottoman Empire

    Ottoman family tree for Tsardoms



    I would like to explain why I choose Suleyman Pasha to be faction heir.
    Tsardoms is starting 1345 AD and at that time he was alive. He was great warrior and good strategists. His father Orhan seen in Suleyman grand prospects of further success for the house of Ottoman. But 1357 he had "accident" and die while he was engaged in the favorite Turkish sport of falconry. He die 2 years before his father.
    The House of Wilpuri ~ Proud Patron of: The Noble Lord & Sumskilz


  13. #133
    Matthæus's Avatar Knez Bribirski
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    Default Re: Faction - Ottoman Empire





    i dont want you think that we are on vacation. here you see timarli sipahi WIP

  14. #134
    nnnm's Avatar Senator
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    Default Re: Faction - Ottoman Empire

    great work guys



  15. #135
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    Default Re: Faction - Ottoman Empire

    Very Nice Siphis!

  16. #136
    Boztorgai_Khan's Avatar Domesticus
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    Default Re: Faction - Ottoman Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by tzar View Post
    Ottoman family tree for Tsardoms



    I would like to explain why I choose Suleyman Pasha to be faction heir.
    Tsardoms is starting 1345 AD and at that time he was alive. He was great warrior and good strategists. His father Orhan seen in Suleyman grand prospects of further success for the house of Ottoman. But 1357 he had "accident" and die while he was engaged in the favorite Turkish sport of falconry. He die 2 years before his father.

    Okay, But I Stay for the Real History.
    And I Want Murad as Faction Heir.
    He Was the 3. Padishah of the Ottomans.



    MOD's: >>> K-MTW2 & EW MOD & BC MOD <<< BoZToRGai KHaN

    Official Web Site: http://www.djeak.com/boztorgaikhan/ (Coming Soon..!!!)

    Website: http://www.cumankipchaksgroup.com/ (Coming Soon..!!!)


  17. #137

    Default Re: Faction - Ottoman Empire

    Well, the real history is important only until the year 1345. After that, everybody will make their own history.

    TTW GRANDMASTER

  18. #138

    Default Re: Faction - Ottoman Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by Boztorgai_Khan View Post
    Okay, But I Stay for the Real History.
    And I Want Murad as Faction Heir.
    He Was the 3. Padishah of the Ottomans.
    I understand you, but like Duce said mod is starting 1345 and Suleyman Pasha was man #2 in the ottoman state at that point. I don't need to explain to you who was Suleyman Pasha and how important he was for ottomans(because you know that). If he was alive and become a Sultan, maybe he would conquer more than Murad

    P.S.
    Thanks for help!
    The House of Wilpuri ~ Proud Patron of: The Noble Lord & Sumskilz


  19. #139
    Boztorgai_Khan's Avatar Domesticus
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    Default Re: Faction - Ottoman Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by tzar View Post
    I understand you, but like Duce said mod is starting 1345 and Suleyman Pasha was man #2 in the ottoman state at that point. I don't need to explain to you who was Suleyman Pasha and how important he was for ottomans(because you know that). If he was alive and become a Sultan, maybe he would conquer more than Murad

    P.S.
    Thanks for help!

    Thank You.. That You Understand Me.

    Okay,



    MOD's: >>> K-MTW2 & EW MOD & BC MOD <<< BoZToRGai KHaN

    Official Web Site: http://www.djeak.com/boztorgaikhan/ (Coming Soon..!!!)

    Website: http://www.cumankipchaksgroup.com/ (Coming Soon..!!!)


  20. #140

    Default Re: Faction - Ottoman Empire

    Quote Originally Posted by matko View Post




    i dont want you think that we are on vacation. here you see timarli sipahi WIP
    Beatiful models Matko as usual By the way the shield size of Sipahis seemed a bit small to me. Coz i've never seen such small shields before.

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