Faction - Principality of Wallachia

**escho** · March 18, 2008, 06:57 AM

These are all excellent images. I'll be sure to copy them over to the developers thread. I have seen images of those chain shirts previously, but I'm lacking in images from historic documents, monasteries etc.

So far we have these units already in for Wallachia. It would be nice to cross-reference these:
1) Vecini (peasants, essentially)
2) Mosieni/Mosneni (sword-armed footmen)
3) Viteji (light cavalry, armed with sabres and either a bow or javelins).
4) Boieri Mari (bodyguard)
5) Boieri Mici (heavy cavalry)
6) Dismounted boieri
7) Ciobani (shepherd archers, as used at the battle of Posada etc.)
8) Mosieni archers (better equipped archers, armored in chainmail)
9) Arbalest marksmen (mentioned in the Chronicles of Wawrin and others)
10) Cuman Horsearchers
11) Cuman heavy cavalry
12) Buzduganieri (macemen)
13) Străjeri (town watch)
14) Armaşi (Professional guards)
15) Voinici (Voiniks etc.)
16) Hussite War Wagons
This is not realistic

**escho** · March 18, 2008, 06:57 AM

you shoul use mircea description of the army

**mircea** · March 18, 2008, 07:45 AM

Here are some images about the Moldavian and Wallachian army during XV-XVI c.

**mircea** · March 18, 2008, 08:38 AM

I have just a few points to comment upon

1) Vecini (peasants, essentially) - Until middle XV, thier number was quite low, but it would work for diversity
2) Mosieni/Mosneni (sword-armed footmen) - they were quite seldomly armed sowrd. Maybe spears or axes or a rugged type of pole weapons
3) Viteji (light cavalry, armed with sabres and either a bow or javelins). - they could be called nemesi in Moldova, they were those pesants that were made nobles for bravery in combat
4) Boieri Mari (bodyguard)
5) Boieri Mici (heavy cavalry)- they formed the Curteni, a medium cavalery
6) Dismounted boieri - in fact many times,, the cavalry fought on foot
7) Ciobani(shepherd archers, as used at the battle of Posada etc.) - I doubt that there were a category of soldiers recruited mainly from sheeperds. Plus it sounds strange
8) Mosieni archers (better equipped archers, armored in chainmail) - they weren't batter armed or protected, they were the basic archers
9) Arbalest marksmen (mentioned in the Chronicles of Wawrin and others) - mercenaries - lefegii
10) Cuman Horsearchers - the cumans were assimilated by 1345, maybe we should have as mercenaries tatar horsearchers
11) Cuman heavy cavalry - no cumans
12) Buzduganieri (macemen) - we didn't had a military unit armed mainly with maces. Maces used especially the great boyars
13) Străjeri (town watch) - I agree
14) Armaşi (Professional guards) - maybe we should have mercenary guards - like the case of english archers at Bran in XV c.
15) Voinici (Voiniks etc.)
16) Hussite War Wagons - the Hussite War Wagons appeared in 2nd part of XV century

**Romano-Dacis** · March 18, 2008, 05:38 PM

Originally Posted by mircea

I have just a few points to comment upon
1) Vecini (peasants, essentially) - Until middle XV, thier number was quite low, but it would work for diversity

I figured we needed some very basic unit. I realize most peasants lived freely, owning their own property, but there were still those that didn't, and more importantly, those that didn't were often forced into battle.

2) Mosieni/Mosneni (sword-armed footmen) - they were quite seldomly armed sowrd. Maybe spears or axes or a rugged type of pole weapons

I primarily chose swords because it would differentiate the Wallachian infantry from the Bulgarian spearmen infantry. However, swords weren't rare; in fact, local blacksmiths made them and they were also imported from Brasov and other areas. We could change it to a spear.

3) Viteji (light cavalry, armed with sabres and either a bow or javelins). - they could be called nemesi in Moldova, they were those pesants that were made nobles for bravery in combat

We'll change it for Moldova.

4) Boieri Mari (bodyguard) - the bodyguards of the two sates were recruited from mercenaries, the boyars were considered unloyal

Alright, but then what do we call them? I was thinking of "Boieri Mari" because they were a part of the "curteni", taking part in the princely court, and as such would have the most at stake if the voievod died.

5) Boieri Mici (heavy cavalry)- they formed the Curteni, a medium cavalery

For the boieri, I am mostly counting on Radu Olteanu as providing source images. There are also some image we have of boieri from decorated terra cota tiles. As such, by what I've seen, they would constitute as heavy cavalry.

6) Dismounted boieri - in fact many times,, the cavalry fought on foot

7) Ciobani(shepherd archers, as used at the battle of Posada etc.) - I doubt that there were a category of soldiers recruited mainly from sheeperds. Plus it sounds strange

I agree it sounds strange, but I thought it could act as a diversifying aspect for Wallachia. Also, they were recorded as playing a pivotal role at Posada, and although there probably wasn't an actual unit made from them, there's little doubt that they fought alongside the Oastea Mare.

8) Mosieni archers (better equipped archers, armored in chainmail) - they weren't batter armed or protected, they were the basic archers

The better armored comment was with regards to comparing them to ciobani (if that unit is in the game). They have a similar degree of protection as other archers.

9) Arbalest marksmen (mentioned in the Chronicles of Wawrin and others) - mercenaries - lefegii

Agreed. It's a better name.

10) Cuman Horsearchers - the cumans were assimilated by 1345, maybe we should have as mercenaries tatar horsearchers
11) Cuman heavy cavalry - no cumans

Agreed. Will be replaced by Tatars.

12) Buzduganieri (macemen) - we didn't had a military unit armed mainly with maces. Maces used especially the great boyars

Actually, archaeologically, maces, including other derivative blunt weapons like maciuci, gioage etc. were used quite frequently by the lower classes. It's among the most frequent weapon used. In fact, at Vaslui, Stephen the Great even made entire military units use nothing but maces and clubs.

However, the name sounds strange (being a literal translation of macemen). I'll see how to fix that.

13) Străjeri (town watch) - I agree

14) Armaşi (Professional guards) - maybe we should have mercenary guards - like the case of english archers at Bran in XV c.

I was thinking this unit could be used to represent a sort of pseudo-gendarmerie, a step towards more professional armies later in the campaign. The Armas at the Sfatul Domnesc carried out punishments and some military duties, hence this unit would represent the men he would command to ensure order. By the early 16th century these sorts of units definitely did exist, as early versions of the "dorobanti".

**~~Miraj~~** · March 18, 2008, 05:46 PM

Great work Phoenix!

**escho** · March 18, 2008, 07:49 PM

**mircea** · March 19, 2008, 06:46 AM

The bodyguards should be called Garda Domneasca
Those that use mace should be called maciucari. Also, the royal family should use topuz, a silver made mace
For diversity we could use the term sagetari(archers), especially for Moldova.

**Romano-Dacis** · March 19, 2008, 01:48 PM

Would "Straja Domneasca" be better or is "Garda Domneasca" best?

**escho** · March 19, 2008, 06:20 PM

Would "Straja Domneasca" be better or is "Garda Domneasca" best?
"Straja Domneasca" is beter but can use one for Tara Romaneasca and another for Moldova

**escho** · March 19, 2008, 08:18 PM

Or:

Garda Domneasca Moldoveana for Moldova-Bodyguarad Heavy Cavalry
diferent skin
Garda Domneasca Munteana?? for Tara Romaneasca-Bodyguarad Heavy Cavalry

Garda Domneasca is a unit for general
very high cost
in unit description info:combined troops mercenaries and some/few nativs

And:

Straja Domneasca Moldoveana for Moldova-Heavy Infantry(another skin,not the skin Bodyguarad Heavy Cavalry for Moldova)
diferent skin
Straja Domneasca Munteana?? for Tara Romaneasca- Heavy Infantry(another skin,not the skin Bodyguarad Heavy Cavalry forTara Romaneasca)

Straja domneasca is a unit with no general recruted
very high cost
in unit description info:combined troops nativs and some/few mercenaries

Sorry for my bad english

"Abia astept sa dau cu: furca,coasa,bata,maciuca,ghioaga,cutitul,arcul,toporul,toporisca,sulita,lancea,sabia,palosul si buzduganul... in turci si unguri... si sa am de partea mea doar pamantul,apele,vazduhul,calul si un scut !!!"

)

**mircea** · March 20, 2008, 05:01 AM

Originally Posted by escho

"Abia astept sa dau cu: furca,coasa,bata,maciuca,ghioaga,cutitul,arcul,toporul,toporisca,sulita,lancea,sabia,palosul si buzduganul... in turci si unguri... si sa am de partea mea doar pamantul,apele,vazduhul,calul si un scut !!!"

)

Yes, your ideas about garda/straja domneasca are very interesting.
Alos some new names for units:
- Vanatorii - maybe combined in Vantorii Domnesti( infantry) or as a regional unit for Neamt(Vanatorii de Neamt)?!
- Plaiesii - synonymous for Strajerii in Moldova
- Mocanii - means ciobanii de munte, as a regional unit for those provinces close to mountains in Wallachia, Moldova and Transylvania
- Slujitorii armasiei/ Slujitorii de margine to replace the armasii as profesional guards?!?

Also we should have regional romanian units in Transylvania in regions like Fagaras, Hateg, Maramures, Apusenii area.
- Vlachian Cnezii - light cavalry, chainmail, sword and bows
- Mocani - infantry archers, no armor
- catanele - basic infantry armed with baltag, or spears

**Romano-Dacis** · March 20, 2008, 11:19 AM

Alright, so I have to following to-do list for Wallachia's units:
-Remove Cumans (replace with Tatars)
-Change name of Buzduganieri to maciucari
-Change bodyguard unit
-Change Arbalest Marksmen to Lefegii
-Add vanatori
-Change Armasi to Slujitori Armasului

OPTIONAL:
-Change armament of Mosneni from sword to spear (I have a book which describes the spears and polearms used by Wallachian infantry in detail)
-Remove ciobani and replace them with the regional unit mocani
-Transylvania regional units (will be done if we have time)

**escho** · March 20, 2008, 04:20 PM

Alright, so I have to following to-do list for Wallachia's units:
-Remove Cumans (replace with Tatars)
-Change name of Buzduganieri to maciucari

Opinions and Sugestions

Alright, so I have to following to-do list for Wallachia's units:
-Remove Cumans (replace with Tatars) they are mercenaries unit;my opinion =Tatars not available for Wallachia/Moldavia only for rebel army in near provincies in East Moldavia :hmmm:hmmm:.rebel army of Tatars raids Moldavia
-Change name of Buzduganieri to maciucari or ghiogari(Wallachia/Moldavia)

sorry ok edit

**Sarmatian** · March 20, 2008, 04:48 PM

escho, would you mind putting other people posts in qoute? It is difficult to see what are you posting and what other people posted....

**escho** · March 20, 2008, 04:50 PM

Maiby somebady correct me

Tatars in history never fight in the Moldavia/Wallachia army;never fight in Moldavia/Wallachia army like alieted unit.

We should have romanian units( Moldavia/Wallachia)-Arcasi Calari(Cavalry horse archers)

For diversity we should have regional romanian units in Transylvania in regions like Fagaras, Hateg, Maramures, Apusenii area.
- Vlachian Cnezii - light cavalry, chainmail, sword and bows
- Mocani - infantry archers, no armor
- catanele - basic infantry armed with baltag, or spears
Majority people in Transilvania is and was(dacians-getae) romanians people.Transilvania was romanian teritory under Ugaria domination in the period of Tsardoms,Transilvania is a romanian province.
we should have regional romanian units in Transylvania

Great post Mircea

**escho** · March 20, 2008, 05:28 PM

Originally Posted by Sarmatian

escho, would you mind putting other people posts in qoute? It is difficult to see what are you posting and what other people posted....

Thank you for advice

**mircea** · March 20, 2008, 08:00 PM

Originally Posted by escho

Maiby somebady correct me

Tatars in history never fight in the Moldavia/Wallachia army;never fight in Moldavia/Wallachia army like alieted unit.

We should have romanian units( Moldavia/Wallachia)-Arcasi Calari(Cavalry horse archers)

According to an hypothesis of Gheorghe Brătianu, P. P. Panaitescu and N. Iorga, Wallachia was allied with tatars against Hungary in 1330. They should be only a regional unit east of Nistru, not a unit of Wallachia or Moldavia

We already have an horse archer unit - Curtenii

Thx escho

**escho** · March 24, 2008, 04:42 PM

This is correct,i read a book thes days

tnx mircea

**il_duce_!** · March 27, 2008, 02:00 AM

Found an interesting picture.

Wallacian shepard

Spoiler Alert, click show to read:

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