Cvria Ivlia, Consulate of Brvtvs/Constantinvs (senate records)

[Kritias]

Senators,make haste with your debating;The pride of Rome is wounded by this unchallenged attack on the Republic's Legions. Are we to let them live,when they insult Rome? I will retrain my men to get them back to full strength while you debate on this.I hope you'll take the right decision,the only decision proper to the situation,we are presented with today;As soon as you give me your order,I will depart to the front and I will annihilate the barbarians!!!No mercy will be shown;They are going to see our men bathe in their blood before they die...

(ooc)wow,I am getting really excited by the turn of events...I thought I was in for a boring week!!!!!!!!!!!

ps:The Princeps Senatus for the Populares is....Senator Lvcivs Valerivs Scipio of the Popvlares!!!(I know its a little early but who isn't bored waiting till Wednesday...)

[We shall fwee...Wode]

I unfortunatly believe that a campaign must be waged to the north. It is most unfortunate as the peace has been disrupted. I will support the motion to march north, but you must be careful. I suggest for now taking bononia and blocking all the paths south through this new boundary(3 i believe, one at segesta, one at the po river and one between the po and mountains above Segesta) rather than an all out strike to conquer the entire area within the alps.

You must be cautious. You will be outnumbered if you launch a full out attack and the populares and I (I hope) will not support any new legions unless of extreme urgency.

Motion: Retaliation against the veneti(correct tribe?)

Take all beneath the alps, yay 2 - nay 1

Take just Bononia and establish new border, 1 yay - 0 nay

[Calvin]

But senator, the Veneti would not have attacked without the backing of the other tribes. They know that they alone could not have hoped to defeat Rome. Their allies could strike us at any moment. I believe we should pacify the whole area.

Take just Bononia and establish new border:

Yay 1 - 1 Nay

[littlejim13]

Take just Bononia and establish new border:

Yay 2 - 1 Nay

There is no need to start a war in the north, we finish the tribe who violated our border and we continue our peace.

[Kritias]

Senator Libo is right;No man would dare oppose us without someone to back him up in his fight against us...I agree with him,the pacification of the region is appropriate;I would propose,instead of recruiting new legions that a garrison is to be recruited in every town we conquer;That way I shall have enough manpower to destroy the field armies of the Free People and we shall maintain order in the towns of Northern Italy.Senator Balbvs,I am negative on your proposal to conquer only Bononia because if it falls I must then keep watch on four fronts rather than two if Segesta is subjugated also.And I cannot keep track of four areas with only three legions!It takes at least a legion to block a pass way,if we sent less men we will be severely outnumbered and probably defeated as when we sent a single legion too close to Pyrrhus!I will not risk my men's lives on such a task!

EDIT: THERE IS NO NEED STARTING A WAR NORTH?????!!!!!! What are you talking about Co-Consul?My men
got attacked today and you claim there's no need in waging war of retaliation?

[sanada]

Take just Bononia and establish new border:

Yay 2 - 2 Nay

The opportunity is to great to pass up senators, forwards to the alps!

[Kritias]

Take just Bononia and establish new borders:

Yay 2 - Nay 3

They attacked my men;I will get my vengeance while I show them why Rome is to be respected and feared by all lesser men.Rome doesn't forgive an insult.Or Forgets...Onward,to the Frozen North!

[We shall fwee...Wode]

I would like to correct the Consul. There are only 3 passes should we take Bononia.

Lvcivs brings in a large map and lays it on the table.

You can see here that there are three choke points for our legions to use and not 4. This makes the long term defence of bononia not only possible, but practical and beneficial.



So please. Why risk many Roman lives in a time of peace. By all means punish those who wronged us, but don't use, no, ABUSE, this chance to break the peace to try and legitimatise an illegal war against all Cisalpine Gaul!

[Kritias]

This is ridiculous at the least! I wasn't the one that proposed war on all of the Free cities in the North!This is a direct attack against me;How dare you claim that I abuse my power as Consul to get a war going on Cisilpine Gaul? How am I supposed to hold ground without great casualties at the least when you propose having only one legion against 3 fullstacks of barbarians around Segesta?Have you seen how many fullstacks are in Northern Italy?You were the one during your term as Consul who said that they have the equivalent of nine legions(see senate records of Consuls Balbvs\Cato)!If you bind me to defend Bononia and Arretium,I will succeed but I will lose many men;Far more if I attack them,deciding where and when to give each fight.Also,the barbarians may come in numbers;What would you think they will do,if they see us besieging a city of theirs?Won't they sent salvation?So I ask you,Conscript Fathers,to dismiss what Senator Balbvs said as wrong;Instead,consider all I have said on the case as realistic at the least.Rome's dignity was offended by this attack;and we are to let them live?Will we cut down the tree but not burn the entire forest?That is what Senator Balbvs proposes...I say "give me a torch"!!!What say you,Senators?Shall we let the Eagle of Rome feast on those who wronged Her???

[Calvin]

This is no longer peace time - the planned ten year peace has been shattered. If we need more legions to deal with the attackers from the north, then I say we recruit them!

[We shall fwee...Wode]

My populares brothers will not allow legions to be recruited to attack all of the northern cities! They are not a unified state! They are 3 separate peoples, and should be dealt like that. By all means attack the Veneti, but those in Segesta and the Insubres in Mediolanum have done us no harm. Leave these peoples be!

[68 Powers]

Ae Senators of Roma,

As tribune of the Plebs i Veto the act of war on all under the Po vally except Bononia. Marcvs Ativs Balbvs motion however, is reasonible as
i did not see any other tribes armies attack our Consul so they are of no concern to us senators.

Take just Bononia

3 yay - 3 nay

Reasons for Veto if some wish to know:
I will not send our legions to waste in the Forests and Bridges that snoopy described.. As we would take Ridiclous Casulities as he said once again. Something me and the people of Rome are not prepared to Sacrifice yet..

[Calvin]

Very well. Then since my motion has been vetoed, I have no choice but to change my vote in the current motion. But take note senators, I have advised against this, and still stand by that judgement.

Motion to take just Bononia:

Yay 4 - 2 Nay

[EmperorCharles]

Motion to take just Bononia:

Yay 5 - 2 Nay

I was just about to vote it my self i whole heartedly agree, but soon we should follow it up. For right now if we where to continue along this path would be over extended. should the senate wish to continue such a conquest more legions would be required or careful planing.

there was another motion on the table


Allying with Syracuse

2 yay 0 nay

[Kritias]

Lets us not forget senators that these men are allied...What will they do if I lead our legions against Bononia?Won't they try to break the siege? I will submit though to the will of the Tribune;No war,we will trust our fate to goddess Fortuna instead! Pious,if not idiotic i call it....I will be leaving to the front then Senators...Pray,as pious men you are,that I am not attacked by a coalition of the Northern Tribes while I siege Bononia.Oh,what of its citizens fate?Shall I bring them in chains back to Rome or your generosity demands that they are left unarmed?

[Nardril]

Motion to take just Bononia:

Yay 5 - 2 Nay

I am very pleased with you Descion brother these men have no idea what they are getting into.

[Winter]

This is an unnacceptable breach of the peace ordered by the senate. I am ashamed to see the Populares in my party supporting this. We agreed on ten years peace, and you have broken that promise. What other commitments will you break?

Motion to take just Bononia:

Yay 5 - 3 Nay

(ooc) considered a veto, but don't want to be a spoil sport

[68 Powers]

Ave Consul,

I suggest we bring them back in Chains. If they wish to attack when not provoked we will show them the consequences of their actions and give the land their nobles own to our Roman Colonists!

[We shall fwee...Wode]

We were attacked which I think warrants a retaliation against those people whom attacked our legions. But as to a full-out war I still oppose. I just want to punish those that attacked us.

[Calvin]

You would suffer an attack on Rome to go unpunished?

Allying with Syracuse

Yay 3 - 0 Nay