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Thread: The Power of Nightmares: Baby It's Cold Outside

  1. #1

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    The Power of Nightmares: Baby It's Cold Outside



    Should we be worried about the threat from organised terrorism or is it simply a phantom menace being used to stop society from falling apart?

    In the past our politicians offered us dreams of a better world. Now they promise to protect us from nightmares.

    The most frightening of these is the threat of an international terror network. But just as the dreams were not true, neither are these nightmares.

    In a new series, the Power of Nightmares explores how the idea that we are threatened by a hidden and organised terrorist network is an illusion.

    It is a myth that has spread unquestioned through politics, the security services and the international media.

    At the heart of the story are two groups: the American neo-conservatives and the radical Islamists.

    Both were idealists who were born out of the failure of the liberal dream to build a better world.

    These two groups have changed the world but not in the way either intended.

    Together they created today's nightmare vision of an organised terror network.

    A fantasy that politicians then found restored their power and authority in a disillusioned age. Those with the darkest fears became the most powerful.

    The rise of the politics of fear begins in 1949 with two men whose radical ideas would inspire the attack of 9/11 and influence the neo-conservative movement that dominates Washington.

    Both these men believed that modern liberal freedoms were eroding the bonds that held society together.

    The two movements they inspired set out, in their different ways, to rescue their societies from this decay. But in an age of growing disillusion with politics, the neo-conservatives turned to fear in order to pursue their vision.

    They would create a hidden network of evil run by the Soviet Union that only they could see.

    The Islamists were faced by the refusal of the masses to follow their dream and began to turn to terror to force the people to "see the truth"'.

    The Power of Nightmares, a three part series begins on Wednesday, 20 October 2004 at 2100 BST on BBC Two with Baby It's Cold Outside.
    Source: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/3755686.stm



    Has anyone been able to catch this BBC program? It's quite refreshing/relieving to hear that finally some in the news are realizing that this terrorist threat is just a scam and a myth. Opinions?
    Hypocrisy is the foundation of sin.

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  2. #2

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    What's going to happen is another huge attack'll happen, and we'll all be afraid again.

    "It's the terrorists, stupid."

  3. #3

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    Originally posted by DavidtheDuke@Nov 7 2004, 11:47 PM
    What's going to happen is another huge attack'll happen, and we'll all be afraid again.

    "It's the terrorists, stupid."
    So one Reichstag isn't enough?
    Hypocrisy is the foundation of sin.

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  4. #4

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    So one Reichstag isn't enough?
    Ther verdict of history will be interesting indeed.
    Former Patron of: Sbsdude, Bgreman, Windblade, Scipii, Genghis Khan, Count of Montesano, Roman American, Praetorian Sejanus

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  5. #5

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    Originally posted by GodEmperor Nicholas@Nov 8 2004, 01:11 AM
    Ther verdict of history will be interesting indeed.
    That depends on who the writer is, and if it decides to favor truth or its image.

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    wilpuri's Avatar It Gets Worse.
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    Originally posted by DavidtheDuke@Nov 8 2004, 10:15 AM
    That depends on who the writer is, and if it decides to favor truth or its image.
    Well, I have no idea what this grand notion of truth will be, but I'm certainly extremely interested in reading a text-book description of events in, say, 30 years time.
    The common culture of a tribe is a sign of its inner cohesion. But tribes are vanishing from the modern world, as are all forms of traditional society. Customs, practices, festivals, rituals and beliefs have acquired a flut and half-hearted quality which reflects our nomadic and rootless existence, predicated as we are on the global air-waves.

    ROGER SCRUTON, Modern Culture

  7. #7

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    Originally posted by wilpuri@Nov 8 2004, 05:58 AM
    Well, I have no idea what this grand notion of truth will be, but I'm certainly extremely interested in reading a text-book description of events in, say, 30 years time.
    agreed.

    What shall we see in children's textbooks around the World in 30 years? The image of Big Brother on the cover, or the statue of liberty?
    Hypocrisy is the foundation of sin.

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  8. #8

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    or of allah perhaps. or maybe there won't be any books. who knows where society will be in 30yrs?

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    That depends on who the writer is, and if it decides to favor truth or its image.
    I never suggested truth would be involved, nor do I think it is possible for any person to involve truth ever. I am just interested in what the consensis will be...

    NM
    Former Patron of: Sbsdude, Bgreman, Windblade, Scipii, Genghis Khan, Count of Montesano, Roman American, Praetorian Sejanus

    My time here has ended. The time of the syntigmata has ended. Such is how these things are, and I accept it. In the several years I was a member of this forum, I fought for what I considered to be the most beneficial actions to enrich the forum. I regret none of my actions, and retain my personal honor and integrity.
    Fallen Triumvir

  10. #10

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    What shall we see in children's textbooks around the World in 30 years? The image of Big Brother on the cover, or the statue of liberty?
    HA! BookS!? In 30 years? HOW naively optimistic If anything, try book...
    He that will not reason is a bigot, He that cannot reason is a fool, He that dares not reason is a slave.

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    The history books are written by the victors!

    Bear in mind that “fear” is a control mechanism, as an illustration of this, any of you who are American please take a moment to answer the following questions. Do you fear being shot by a gun? Do you own a gun? Would you consider owning a gun for your own protection? If the answer to any of these questions is yes, then you have successfully been controlled through fear. Don’t fret too much about it, your whole nation is under the same spell.

    For anybody that wishes to disagree with me, bear in mind that gun crime in America is off the scale compared to any other western nation. What differentiates America from these nations? The right to bear arms!

  12. #12
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    Originally posted by Derkon@Nov 8 2004, 03:20 PM
    Do you fear being shot by a gun? Do you own a gun? Would you consider owning a gun for your own protection?
    I can honestly answer no to your questions as I am not afraid. I do not fear what tomorrow brings or for that matter today, nor do I fear being shot. I also don't fear a 'terrorist' attack even though I was one of the fortunate who worked in the WTC on 9/11 and can still tell the tale. I don't fear the gov't either, regardless of how low they will go to scare me. What I do fear is the future of humanity and how bleek it gets every day. I fear for my family living in apocalyptic times, I fear for the future of the little ones who have yet to know of the evil in the world and I fear for the few 'good' people left among us who will get swallowed up by the evil unless something is done. I fear that things will only get worse before they improve and I fear that the worst is yet to come and we are experiencing the calm before the storm.
    A fantasy that politicians then found restored their power and authority in a disillusioned age. Those with the darkest fears became the most powerful.
    It should be read: "those who prey upon and weild the darkest fears become the most powerful as it is fear that gives men wings." Great post Siblesz, I can tell that you're one of the people that can see things with both eyes open. I would like to see that program, but unfortunately I don't have it where I live.

  13. #13
    Marshal Qin's Avatar Bow to ME!!!
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    Originally posted by The Cimmerian@Nov 8 2004, 11:47 AM
    I can honestly answer no to your questions as I am not afraid. I do not fear what tomorrow brings or for that matter today, nor do I fear being shot. I also don't fear a 'terrorist' attack even though I was one of the fortunate who worked in the WTC on 9/11 and can still tell the tale. I don't fear the gov't either, regardless of how low they will go to scare me. What I do fear is the future of humanity and how bleek it gets every day. I fear for my family living in apocalyptic times, I fear for the future of the little ones who have yet to know of the evil in the world and I fear for the few 'good' people left among us who will get swallowed up by the evil unless something is done. I fear that things will only get worse before they improve and I fear that the worst is yet to come and we are experiencing the calm before the storm.
    I agree, I have 3 children including a new baby girl and I worry about their futures. All I can do is prepare them as best I can with the knowledge that I have and, should the need arise, I have 9 yrs of military service that may help. I live in a region with the best probability of avoiding severe problems - a mountainous area of central China, and I can always retreat to my home in Australia if things get wierd here too.
    Of course, its not good to get so paranoid that you fail to live a normal life in the event that nothing bad actually happens. You just need to have a realistic outlook on life mixed with a knowledge and basic understanding of world events to hopefully forwarn you of any radical changes.
    9/11 was not so surprising in hindsight, we should have expected it and in some ways we probably did in an abstract way. It was the scale of the event that was unimaginable. Potential futures are not so abstract to me after 9/11 so I live for the present and do my best to prepare my children. What else can a parent do?
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  14. #14

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    Qin, if you accept advise I venture to give you one:
    Stay in China.

    Ozland is getting 'hen pu hao'.
    sic transit gloria mundi

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    Marshal Qin's Avatar Bow to ME!!!
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    so i've noticed, but central Australia is untouchable and I have strong connections both there (I nearly bought a dugout in coober pedy) and in the northern territory which I know very well after my time in the army.

    danshi wo ye jiedao zhonguo you hen da de wenti. tamen de yinghang shi hen bu hao. wo airen shi tujia ren zai wufeng suoyi wo keyi zhu zai nar. (sorry if my pinyin is a bit off and western phoeneticised(?). I don't write the language, just try to speak it)
    Exotic Slave - Spook 153, Barbarian Turncoat - Drugpimp, Catamite - Invoker 47
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  16. #16

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    ha!

    wo bu shi zhong guo ren - wo shi ang moh ren. wo airen shi han ren zai sin jia pore . wo bu zhi dao ni de pin yin :

    ang moh=west in hokkien
    sic transit gloria mundi

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    Originally posted by Marshal Qin@Nov 9 2004, 03:03 AM
    Of course, its not good to get so paranoid that you fail to live a normal life in the event that nothing bad actually happens. You just need to have a realistic outlook on life mixed with a knowledge and basic understanding of world events to hopefully forwarn you of any radical changes.
    Believe me, I'm not one of those wackos that put tinfoil over their head or anything like that; even though my posts may sound like I am sometimes
    I do try and make the most of life, enjoying what ever I can but I do not allow myself to be blinded by lies, propaganda and fear as most people are. I always try to keep my eyes and ears open to the events that are unfolding in the world, but I won't let them get the best of me. I just feel for my fellow humans, such as yourself, that simply want to live a life of peace and take care of their loved ones. I wish sometimes that I had the power to ensure such a peace for all, but since I don't I merely try to show people another perspective on the 'truth' that is fed to them and how people need to start thinking and doing things for themselves. People are becoming too ingnorant and too dependent on others and therefore are more easily kept in line and contented as cattle are awaiting the meat house, unaware of the dangers that lie within. I sometimes envy the ignorant as they don't know the true nature of the beast and therefore can live somewhat peacfully, but I'm content with my choice to take the red pill and know the truth. *smokin*

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    lawngnome's Avatar Cool as a Dry Ice.
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    I don't buy into this whole "we are controlled by fear" thing... maybe some wierd Americans are... me? I have never been afraid for my safety, even when I was in war... I take common sense precautions to protect my family and my well-being, i.e. I lock my house up at night, but I don't own a gun, nor am I afraid of being shot. Maybe I am unique since I don't really worry about anything, but I think this "controlled by fear" thing is just the newest conspiracy theory on the block. Maybe I just haven't met as many ignorant people as the rest of you have, though.

    Seriously, I just think people who have nuclear bunkers, "prepared" for Y2K, or are afraid of another 9/11 are just a little off-kilter.


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  19. #19

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    Originally posted by lawngnome@Nov 10 2004, 06:07 PM
    I don't buy into this whole "we are controlled by fear" thing... maybe some wierd Americans are... me? I have never been afraid for my safety, even when I was in war... I take common sense precautions to protect my family and my well-being, i.e. I lock my house up at night, but I don't own a gun, nor am I afraid of being shot. Maybe I am unique since I don't really worry about anything, but I think this "controlled by fear" thing is just the newest conspiracy theory on the block. Maybe I just haven't met as many ignorant people as the rest of you have, though.

    Seriously, I just think people who have nuclear bunkers, "prepared" for Y2K, or are afraid of another 9/11 are just a little off-kilter.


    God Bless,
    lawngnome
    It's not an apparent danger... the Nazis were not an apparent danger until 1933... It's an ideological danger.

    Americans ARE geniunly scared by terrorists... After 9-11, the anti-depressent business sky rocketed. The ignorant remained blind. The country was completely united against Bush for a year or two. This was the real danger involved. Not only did Bush experience 93% of popularity among the people after the events of 9-11, but he ALSO controlled the GOVERNMENT by near 100%.

    It's called the Reichstag effect... Now don't call me a conspiracy theorist, because I ain't. I don't think the government was involved in the planning of 9-11. Maybe a small faction of the government or maybe a small circle of isolated generals or retired leaders worked with Al Qaeda to bring 9-11 into effect to provide for the Reichstag effect here in the U.S., but I don't think the government, in its general sense, had anything to do with the planning of 9-11.

    What I do know is that this terrible event was leached upon by the Republican leaders of the U.S. government. The Patriot Act, among other "terrorist" protection acts and treaties, were passed unanimously in the senate and almost unanimously in the hosue... there was only 1 or 2 nay votes in the senate... The World was immensly FOR Bush and FOR the invasion of Afghanistan after 9-11... which was a good thing... but this Reichstag effect carried on even to today in many aspects of the Bush society.

    Bush used his Reichstag effect to gain support for the invasion of Iraq and the deposal of Saddam Hussein, and then, AGAIN, he used what was left of the Reichstag effect to cover up his poor record, and run a campaign of fear from both terrorism and from morality to lauch himself back into re-election.

    This is the true nightmare that is Bush and his buddies... Even though they have a horrid record, they still manage to hold more than 50% of the vote, which not even Clinton could crack.

    Now just imagine that a 9-11 Version 2 happens... What then? If the Reichstag effect of the first 9-11 caused so much havoc in 3 years, just imagine what Bush and his buddies can do if another attack is made. Martial law? Dictatorial power? Invasive totalitarian censorship of the press and people? Who knows... because I sure don't want to know.
    Hypocrisy is the foundation of sin.

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    Now just imagine that a 9-11 Version 2 happens... What then?
    As you've said, I'm trying not to as I would rather not know what horrors lie ahead. I commend you for your insight as always Sibelsz and I sense an awakening of the truth within you merely by reading some of your posts.
    Americans ARE geniunly scared by terrorists...
    Most, yes, but not all. I for one am not afraid as there is nothing to fear but fear itself. If most of the Americans that are being fooled through scare tactics would simply remind themselves of that creto, then I think that this country would be open for improvement; but since they are afraid, than I feel that this country is headed on the path of self destruction. History has taught us that even the greatest 'empires' have been checked by time and eventually collapse or implode on themself or get weakened to a mere shadow of their former self. I believe that will eventually be the case with America, but I worry about my loved ones should it happen soon.

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