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Thread: 4 reasons for competition

  1. #1
    Manningham's Avatar Civitate
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    Default 4 reasons for competition

    I'm not trying to take anything from ETW, it will certainly be entertaining. But...

    1 - In many ways, Total War's focus is broadening. The campaign map will encompasses a far greater stretch of territory, and with the figure of 10 playable factions being given, detail will likely be sacrificed on a similar scale.

    A competitive title could capitalize on focus, a small land area and/or timeframe with great detail . The RTW mod Iberia Total War comes to mind on this point, having proven the rich potential of smaller scale

    2 - The timeframe change is huge. Warfare in the 18th century is radically different from previous time periods and as we can already see, fan interest is highly variable. A title in classical or medieval time periods will be in demand.

    3 - CA appears, since RTW, to have been shifting its priorities from gameplay to aesthetic improvement. AI development has been lagging, especially in the changes from RTW to M2. Some rival product might sacrifice polish for innovation in gameplay mechanics - this opens the door for lower budget studios to compete.

    4 - Realism - demand for a more realistic interpretation of the in-game setting is evident by the popularity of many modding community releases.

    For these reasons I think it makes sense that a competitor with longevity might finally arise to CA's creation
    "It don't matter to Jesus"
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  2. #2

    Default Re: 4 reasons for competition

    On the contrary to point 1, but I think that fewer factions means more detail will be focused into each of the factions. After all, it makes sense, as this era is one where major powers got very powerful, and smaller ones were conquered or absorbed. After all, it is this era that led to the cataclysm of World War 1 where 4 of the 5 empires in the fighting collapsed (Austria-Hungary, Russia, Germany, and Ottoman - all of whose ancestors or selves are rumored to be playable in this game or are confirmed to be playable already) and where those very empires rose in power. And since the sides were considerably different in their tactics in fighting and in culture, if they do stick with being historical, we should see much more diversity and attention to detail in the sides (after all, it wouldn't make any sense to see the British with massive conscripted armies in this era for example).

    On point 2, yes the change is massive compared to the other eras: but only with one respect, its no longer a sword & spear type game. In terms of strategic depth and tactics, this era may actually be deeper than the previous eras. Rather than the typical pin the enemy with infantry then destroy them with cavalry flanking (or horse archer harassment for eastern nations as the main tactic), we'll see the effects of well positioned artillery, infantry formations, skirmishing, etc.

    I agree that with #3, graphics have seemed to dominate recent releases. BUT, i think with a new engine, and more experience, they have the potential to do better than with RTW and M2TW. As modders may know, while M2TW gave us more modability, the engine was still limited in the same way as RTW, and so things like AI and so on were heavily hardcoded and its core could not be changed. A fresh engine start means that, at the least, the AI won't be the same as RTW and M2TW unless it is intentionally made that way (which would be a shame).

    As far as realism goes, there IS a reason why mods do it whereas game developers, and not just CA, have tended to shy away from it: sales. Mods don't require (or are even allowed) sales to succeed - they are often targetted at a small niche audience and target. After all, that's why there are so many mods, to fit each small groups needs. The majority of buyers of the game aren't going to be interested in super-historical and realistic simulations. So long as they give us the ability to mod the game to our own personal likings, I can't complain.

    And anyways, competition is good as it will spurt improvements on products and I'm sure CA would agree with that. But, considering ETW was announced just yesterday, and in all likelihood will not be available until late 2008 at the earliest, we have an entire year's worth of preview information we need to see before we declare a product dead!

  3. #3

    Default Re: 4 reasons for competition

    wow chewietobbacca, i couldn't have said it better myself, +rep

    rep me if you like my posts, and it's highly likely you'll get some back

  4. #4
    Yoda Twin's Avatar Vicarius
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    Default Re: 4 reasons for competition

    + rep Chewietobbacca, great post. I think that the factions are going to be as unique as ever. They learned from Med2 that mass playable factions wont get you sales.
    Last edited by Yoda Twin; August 23, 2007 at 02:39 AM. Reason: grammar
    Minister for Home Affairs of the Commonwealth v Zentai [2012] HCA 28 per Heydon J at [75]

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  5. #5
    Manningham's Avatar Civitate
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    Default Re: 4 reasons for competition

    Chew -
    Good post, all true. My point is probably less bold than you're interpretting it. I'm certainly not implying that the TW line is dead, or dying, or anything like that. Just that CA's been moving in a certain direction for some time now and that room has opened behind them for another product to fill.

    I wouldn't underestimate the number of fans looking for either a more realistic vision, perhaps not "super-historical". Nor would I downplay those who prefer sword and spear to gunpowder combat, though I'm not too particular about it.

    Shogun, after all, was a far more specific and obscure setting, yet it took the first steps toward our current manifestation. And what was Shogun if not the exploitation of paths rejected by its contemporary strategy games?

    CA isn't making a mistake, but every step forward leaves space for another path. And like you said, competition is good

    ps - regarding Shogun, I call it more specific fully remembering it had a mere 5 factions and countless other deficiencies in comparison with later releases but its reasonable that a game with similar parameters, if released today, would be far more detailed and extensive

    edit: I remain skeptical as to how CA will handle hardcoding, regardless of the opportunity provided by a new engine. Hopefully they'll open it up for the modding community, but I just don't want to get my hopes up
    Last edited by Manningham; August 24, 2007 at 05:46 AM. Reason: one more thing
    "It don't matter to Jesus"
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