republic of venice

[pcp]

are there new improvements or new adds on for the republic of venice's faction? are the units historically accuracy?
can you post some screenshots?

thanxx

[Ahiga]

No venice in our mod. Their presence in the Near East is similar to the Hashashin, in being relavent and important, but unable to be represented in the manner that factions are ingame. Representing them as a conquering nation would feel very out of place and out of character, though they did become a political entity as our timeline would end.

Any presence of Italian Merchants will be reflected in ancillaries, traits, perhaps a guild to represent a strong trade-presence of theirs there, and in the description of our Latin Crossbowmen (I forget the name we give them, but they are basically a representation of merchant marines, well armored sergeants, and other such professional soldiers armed with sword, shield, crossbow, and mail armor).

[Rex Armeniae]

Btw, how will crusades be presented in the mod? I mean like... mongols invade later in the game... could u make a venetian army coming on crusade or something?
Just wondering.

cheers

[firekiller]

nice idee arsen

[Manuel Komnenos]

I think that was stated that no 4th crusade will came, but I'm not sure. Mirage?

[Ermeni]

only venetian actions against the Muslims that i come to think of is naval support to the crusader states......maybe something for later versions

[Ermeni]

only venetian actions against the Muslims that i come to think of is naval support to the crusader states......maybe something for later versions

sorry for the double post....moderator is free to remove....

[teh.frickin.pope]

I think that was stated that no 4th crusade will came, but I'm not sure. Mirage?

From what I remember, it might be a pretty strong rebel army that is scripted to besiege constantinople. But I could be wrong.

Edit: discussion here: http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=108019

[Manuel Komnenos]

Yes, you are true, but not new faction, if I read correctly.

[Ahiga]

only venetian actions against the Muslims that i come to think of is naval support to the crusader states......maybe something for later versions

There's no chance that Venice will be in our mod.

A 4th Crusade is certainly a possibility, as a spawned rebel stack.

Edit: Manuel is right I believe. We haven't given much stock to a Latin Kingdoms (The Balkans/Anatolian Crusader States) faction as we can easily represent the emergence of the 4th Crusade with a Rebel stack. Whether we do or not I am not certain on. I imagine if not for 1.0, then a later version may have such an event.

[Ermeni]

There's no chance that Venice will be in our mod.

A 4th Crusade is certainly a possibility, as a spawned rebel stack.

Edit: Manuel is right I believe. We haven't given much stock to a Latin Kingdoms (The Balkans/Anatolian Crusader States) faction as we can easily represent the emergence of the 4th Crusade with a Rebel stack. Whether we do or not I am not certain on. I imagine if not for 1.0, then a later version may have such an event.

i did not suggest that venice should be in the mod......was thinking that italian fleets could be in the game in some way...maybe as a naval mercenary unit and would be recruitable only by the KOJ......also i said for later versions....don't wanna push you guys....

[Ahiga]

i did not suggest that venice should be in the mod......was thinking that italian fleets could be in the game in some way...maybe as a naval mercenary unit and would be recruitable only by the KOJ......also i said for later versions....don't wanna push you guys....

No worries ermeni. Wasn't mad at you or anyone. Just wanted to state that for effect, so there'd be no ambiguity or doubt behind our intentions.

Sorry if I gave the impression that I was mad.

[Miraj]

LOL. Republic of Venice. LOL.

Look here:



That map can answer the question quite well.

And we will probably never include a West European faction aside from KoJ (assuming KoJ can be considered W. Euro). We might add some east European factions in the far future. But thats a giant 'if'.

[yigisina]

If you really wanted to push it I suppose you could be slightly inaccurate timewise and give them Cyprus, with a huge port.

[Ahiga]

If you really wanted to push it I suppose you could be slightly inaccurate timewise and give them Cyprus, with a huge port.

I think they took Cyprus much later in the future, in the 1300s or 1400s. Plus, just like an Italian fan might go 'why include Transoxania or Volga Bulgaria' in MTR, I go 'why should we include an Italian faction in a mod focused on a region wholly removed from them, except for trade influences?'

If we pushed the timeline for cyprus, it would be for that Kingdom of Cyprus. Which doesn't really interest us. The only remaining Western European faction that has been given any sort of serious consideration is Antioch, and they remain rather light in terms of our interest in them. For the most part they were under the thumb of Byzantium, or Armenia.

[yigisina]

True true, they don't really have much of a place in this area to be honest. I just feel though if they were to be represented, a single island in the form of a rich trade centre would be their place. They shouldn't really expand just stay and grow on the island and act as mercs for Christians. Still to be honest not worth the effort really and not accurate.

[The Mongol]

BC still has the best of Venice, Warhammer wielding Italians.

I'd say check out the Levies & Mercenaries thread but AlphaDelta's photobucket has combusted.

[Ahiga]

True true, they don't really have much of a place in this area to be honest. I just feel though if they were to be represented, a single island in the form of a rich trade centre would be their place. They shouldn't really expand just stay and grow on the island and act as mercs for Christians. Still to be honest not worth the effort really and not accurate.

Yeah. It's disappointing we cannot represent the Hashashin or Venetians the way they deserve to be, because both were important figures in this area. It's just as you say - it wouldn't be the effort, wouldn't be accurate, and would feel shoved in, and not fitted to our mod.

I imagine in the future, if we choose to look at coming up with new guilds, a Venetian Trade one would be perfect for their historical nature. As the Mongol says, some of our upper echelon mediterranean levies represent Italian Merchants, and it's assumed that in the ranks of Latin Crossbowmen, some are sergeants, while others are Italian Merchants choosing to serve in the army.

[CtrlAltDe1337]

You could give the KoJ a "Venetian Galley" warship thats a top-of-the-line until gunpowder comes along (or maybe make the VG a gunpowder ship). Also, you could make an "Italian Quarter" building for the KoJ (and maybe Armenia and the Byzantines) that boosts trade. This could help represent Venice's presence without creating a new faction.

[Recon]

Why not represent Genoa also? without the geonese fleets Jerusalem would probably never have been sieged. And why stop there..? heck why not Norway, Denmark, Sweden, France, England, HRE ect. all had an impact one way or another.