Nagorno-Karabakh Dispute

[Drtad]

Here is a recent article on the subject:

Aliyev Claims International Support On Karabakh

BAKU (RFE/RL)--Azeri President Ilham Aliyev has claimed that his government's stated refusal to ever recognize Nagorno-Karabakh's de facto secession from Azerbaijan is supported by the international community. In his New Year address to the nation, Aliyev also repeated his regular pledges to embark on a military build-up, which he hopes will eventually force the Armenians to relinquish the disputed territory. "The most gratifying case is that the OSCE Minsk Group co-chairs, the Minsk Group, international organizations support Azerbaijan's position. The territorial integrity [of Azerbaijan] will never be a topic of discussions," he said, according to BBC. The Azerbaijani leader pointed to international condemnation of the December referendum in Karabakh that resulted in the passage of the self-proclaimed republic's first-ever constitution. But he made no mention of the Minsk Group's existing peace proposals that have been discussed by the conflicting parties over the past two years. The proposed plan calls for a referendum of self-determination in Karabakh to be held years after the liberation of Armenian-controlled Azerbaijani districts surrounding the territory. Armenian officials say Karabakh's mainly ethnic Armenian voters would be able to decide whether they want to be independent, reunify with Armenia or return under Azerbaijani rule. Aliyev insisted, however, that Baku could only grant Karabakh "greater autonomy opportunities within Azerbaijan on condition that Azerbaijan's territorial integrity is secured." "This is our constructive position and beyond this no negotiations were held and will not be held in future," he said. Aliyev also repeated his claims that Azerbaijan's soaring oil revenues will translate into military superiority over the Armenian side. "We are at talks but the enemy should know that Azerbaijan can liberate native lands by any means at any time and we shall liberate it," he said. "From now on, the army will be paid much attention." Aliyev and Kocharian revived international hopes for a near-term solution to the Karabakh dispute following their most recent face-to-face meeting held in Belarus last month. Both leaders said they made further progress towards the signing of a framework peace accord. But Kocharian cooled renewed talk of a Karabakh breakthrough later in December, saying that there will be no "active negotiating process" until next spring's Armenian parliamentary elections. Still, diplomatic sources say the parties and the international mediators plan to make a fresh and possibly decisive push for Karabakh peace in the second half of this year, before presidential elections due in both Armenia and Azerbaijan in 2008.

Thursday, January 4, 2007

What are your opinions? Should Armenia be forced to give back a small piece of land that is populated by only Armenians and has been an Armenian territory since ancient times?

EDIT: The wiki article on the war for this territory in case you need to read up on it:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Karabakh_War

[Shadowcry]

How many people live in Nagorno-Karbash?

[humvee2800]

I think It should revolt with a arab version of George washington.

[Miraj]

Whatever the case is, what someone supposedly had since "ancient times" shouldn't enter the equation. We're in the 21st century, a century where people should learn to put aside their ethnicities and historical grudges and try to live together.

[Eranshahr]

I think Armenia should keep Karabakh, I mean it is not connected to Azeribaijan and the population are ethnic Armenians- has nothing to do with Azeri people.


But if there should be like the ancient times, Then i think all of ME and central asia should surrender their soveregnity to Iran and Italy( roman empire) History has changed, we msut follow the borders of 2007 now.

[RusskiSoldat]

I sympathize with the Armenians solely because I am part Armenian, but am generally against separatism.

[Gerin]

The Azeri people should just let the people in Karabakh do whatever they want it is mostly worthless mountains and the people are not Azeri citizens.

While generally I am also against seperatism Karabakh is most likely to be swallowed by Armenia, so it isn't worth it to destroy what basicly amounts to
a small country of mostly Armenians and thus would be a genocide.

[Icefrisco]

Armenia did launch an invasion of the land. However, the people want to be part of Armenia. So what Armenia should do is compensate Azeribaijan for the loss of land. However, I doubt they would ever do that. Armenia is economically depressed and it seems most "wealthy" Armenians live in Israel or America. So until Armenia becomes more economically stable there wont be peace. As long as one side is in a bad economic situation there will be fighting (e.g. Syrians+Palestinians and Israelis).

[Tiwaz]

I think Armenia should keep Karabakh, I mean it is not connected to Azeribaijan and the population are ethnic Armenians- has nothing to do with Azeri people.

Not to say which side should have what piece of dirt...

Actually that territory is very connected to Azerbaijan. It appears to be in fact land locked inside Azerbaijan.

[Miraj]

[Drtad]

Remember that the whole thing did not start because of ancient ties. First of all, the land was unjustly taken by Azerbaijan during the Soviet Union. Secondly Armenians were just demonstrating for its reunification with Armenia until the Sumgait Pogrom. Armenia aided Karabakh not only to reunify it but to protect the Armenians living there.

Actually that territory is very connected to Azerbaijan. It appears to be in fact land locked inside Azerbaijan.

During the war Armenia occupied the area in between Armenia and Karabakh (Battle of Kelbajar), so it isn't locked in anymore.

[Tiwaz]

During the war Armenia occupied the area in between Armenia and Karabakh (Battle of Kelbajar), so it isn't locked in anymore.

Unfortunately for Armenia, it joined UN and ratified it's charter 1992.

Attack took place 1993.

Thus, any invaded territories remain Azeri territory in UN opinion. UN charter explicitly forbids any territorial gains through use of force, and condemns even use of force.

Thus, that territory is still land locked. Armenia won't be able to get acceptance on it's territorial gains from UN unless Azerbaijan hands them over. Which it most likely won't do.

[Drtad]

Well, at the moment what the UN thinks doesn't matter, over 20% of Azerbaijan's territory is de facto Armenian. The Armenian president Kocharian is from Karabakh itself, and he says giving it to Azerbaijan is not an option. Azeri president Aliyev also says that he will do anything to take it back, but apparently the Armenians are dug in so well it seems to be an impossibility.

By the way, Armenia is currently building a large freeway to connect Karabakh with Armenia, and the UN's border drawing won't effect the physical connection.

[Tiwaz]

Well, at the moment what the UN thinks doesn't matter, over 20% of Azerbaijan's territory is de facto Armenian. The Armenian president Kocharian is from Karabakh itself, and he says giving it to Azerbaijan is not an option. Azeri president Aliyev also says that he will do anything to take it back, but apparently the Armenians are dug in so well it seems to be an impossibility.

By the way, Armenia is currently building a large freeway to connect Karabakh with Armenia, and the UN's border drawing won't effect the physical connection.

You would be surprised how much UN drawing lines matters.

To put it simply, nobody besides Armenia accepts those lines drawn by Armenia to be anything but false. Thus, there is no repercussions for Azerbaijan to kick out Armenians.

Just look at Israel. They still cannot lay claim of ownership on territories they have captured. And they are forced to slowly give them up piece by piece.

Without UN acceptance, Armenia does not really have anything.

[Miraj]

Wow thats small.



And check out that little chunk that Azerbaijan controls on the other side.

[Eranshahr]

I've got it all wrong

I thought it was the other one, you know. The one located on the other side of Armenia.

ok now that I know which one it is, i think Azeribaijan should keep it, I mean, it is a very small piece of land and it is inside Azerbaijan, giving it to Armenia would make the area surrounded by Azeri military- leading to war.

[Sétanta]

Armenia needs to do one of two things. 1) Kick Azerbaijan's ass in a war, again and take Nagorno-Karabakh by force, or 2) Pay for the land, and then annex it.

Azerbaijan needs to realize, it isn't part of their country, and never will be.

[Miraj]

Which part of Armenia are you from, dear?

[Sétanta]

Which part of Armenia are you from, dear?

Oh you know, Yerevan. Go Armenia.

[Miraj]

Do you need pom poms too sweetheart?

BTW, you could just go "Me Christian, die Muslim". Saves the typing.