Unit proposals

[DimeBagHo]

hacon: Thanks for the info. I've seen that article before. It's very interesting, although naturally it involves quite a lot of speculation.

"Spartan Rangers" is a generic term used to describe the forces they used for light infantry, scouting battlefields, and so on. In the classical period they used the Sciritae for that, but I'm guessing that they replaced them with other troops for the same role after they lost Sciritis.

Zarax: I think we could easily lose the Krypteia entirely - I can't remember the last time I recruited any. Still "more Spartan units" is one of the most common requests we get.

[][Xyphos][ - Lee]

I no theres a unit for greece called Sacred band, but what about the Theban sacred band, they could be like a elite unit like the spartans and make the other sared band slighty worse statwise, so that greece doesnt have 3 mega units

[Locky]

The Theban scared band was destroyed at the battle of Choranae. The new sacred band is supposed to ressemble it.

@Dime: maybe you could call them Spartan Theurophoroi?

[][Xyphos][ - Lee]

The Theban scared band was destroyed at the battle of Choranae. The new sacred band is supposed to ressemble it.

@Dime: maybe you could call them Spartan Theurophoroi?

lol yeah i no they were defeted at Choranae, that doesnt make a difference lol i just thourght it would be better to give them there full name.

[DimeBagHo]

Maybe the best option for a new Spartan unit would be the Perioici. They could be a little better than regular hoplites, recruitable in Sparta at the City Barracks level. That would give us a chance to use another one of ATGs Spartan skins, and it would mean that the player would not have to wait as long before recruiting some pretty Spartan units.

[Athenean21]

i must say that i am very happy to see that an early spartan unit is considered. It must be said that getting i.e. spartan hoplites takes many turns. The balance of the game -if sparta gets good infantry quite early- maybe could come from diminishing the number of soldiers in the unit.
Game balance and historical accuracy are in my opinion two completely different things. Elite units -like spartans- can no longer be recruited or retrained outside Sparta so in reality there is no use to take them with you very far except maybe for capturing a settl/nt to use as a base in a different region. The opposite is that if i play the Bruti i can attack sparta early on and fight against the militia - not quite historical.

By the way, i still play the mundus magnus XGm 2 2 1 as i believe that the latter versions -though wonderful- have lost a little bit from the original concept of a 'greek mod'.
Because im not good in moding could you create files for the 2.2.1 version when you add new units to XgM. Thanks for your excellent work once again

[DimeBagHo]

Unfortunately I don't have time to back-port new units to the older versions of XGM. Adding them yourself is not very hard though.

[Dom9127]

Do you think that you could give the Barbarian chosen archers, swords because at the moment even though they have high attack values they are using tiny daggers and in their unit description it says they have "high quality swords".

[Archbaker]

It looks like my last post got eaten by the forum, so I'll make it again. I believe Dimebag already has thought about more barbarian spearmen, but I figured it couldn't hurt to propose some.


1.) Chosen Spearmen
2.) German
3.) Marian
4.) Semi-elite (good defence, decent attack, but only moderate morale)
5.) Like Spear Warband, but wearing maille
6.) No AOR
7.) Not based on a specific historical tribe or unit, but building on the assumption that military reforms would lead the Germans to give better armour to their line infantry.
8.) Shield Wall



1.) Noble Spearmen
2.) German
3.) Game start
4.) elite
5.) Round shields, spears. I'm sure you have good sources to what a Germanic noble might wear.
6.) Northern Europe. Also available as mercenaries in Central Europe.
7.) A speculative unit to make use of the Schiltrom ability. Otherwise similar to the Germanic Foot Nobles proposed above.
8.) Schiltrom, effective against cavalry

[Hippias]

Gallic Heavy Spearband
Gaul
Post-Marius
Elite
Mail/theuros/spear/sword or javelins
Gaul
EB Mori Gaesum, Carnute Cingetos or Arjos
Shieldwall (or warcry)
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Sarmatian Noble Cavalry
Scythians
Post-Marius
Elite
Kontos, Bow, Scale armour (man & horse)
East steppe
EB Roxolani or Aorsi Nobles

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Please can you consider a les "Zulu" shield & warpaint for the Ptolomies Nubian units.

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Please, please can the Gauls have slingers

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If you are using BI units for Sabeans (hooray!!) please consider the Sassinid Sughdian Warrior (see EB's Sabean Noble Infantry)

[Maraxus]

1) Sabaean Chariots
2) Sabaean
3) 2nd Century BC (but probably from game's start)
4) Elite
5) Scythed horses with Heavily Armored rider
6) Southern Arabia/Eastern Africa
7) Sabaean Coinage from 2nd C.
http://www.nbd.com/NBD/NBD_CDA/CDA_W...lamic_coinage/
8) I know the 2nd Century is a ways off from XGMs start time but the Sabaeans need more units especially cav and Egypt had been using Chariots forever so they were easily exposed to them earlier. I'd like to see a heavy spearmen or heavy sparabara rider instead of a Cataphract rider due to the fact that the Sabaeans were not a part of the Persian Empire and would not have used Persian style riders, plus all that armor doesn't really help when your chariot's defensive rating is 1.

[Zarax]

Maybe they could get jav chariots, it should be fun...

[Hippias]

Wasn't that wherethe queen of sheba was supposed to have come from? A rich desert faction, semitic looking, plenty of robes, camels etc. It will be nice to have a faction totally untouched by the greek world (no phalanxs, pikes, theuphoroi etc).

These guys are really hard to find out any information on so I say its' time for some imaginative roster ideas to givethem a different look (whilst avoiding fantasy units) What about dipylon/gerrhon shields rather than the usual theuros?

Kudos to Maraxus with the chariot idea. Hopefully theSaba can expand towards Petra/Palmyra andwe wil have Queen Zenobia's realm a couple of centuries early.

Cheers

Just my 2 shekels.

[Zarax]

Can you give me more info about these shields?

[DimeBagHo]

Chariots sound good. The Sabaeans definitely had them way before the game period. I don't know whether they still made military use of them in the game period, but I think they would be a nice addition. We could make them javelin, or archers.

Dipylon shields sound good as well. Here are some of the unit ideas I'm thinking about so far (including suggestions from Hippias and Zarax in other threads):

Light Axe: Sparabara body, no armor, either a round wicker shield, or maybe the cut-away Baktrian Archer shield.

Heavy Mace: Sparabara or Eastern Heavy Infantry body, scale armour, maces from Sughdian warriors, Dipylon shield.

Heavy Spear: Similar to the maces, but armed with spears.

Archers and Heavy Archers: I'll probably switch their basic archer unit to the Baktrian style, and I might add a heavier version with no shield and double handed axes.

Light cavalry: Like Pontic Light cavalry.

[Zarax]

Archer/axeman? That's wicked

[Hippias]

Zarax - the diplyon shield is like a larger theuros with crescents cut away on both sides at the middle. Covered in oxhide (Dime - possible to have oxhide 'body shield' for Nubian spearmen?). The gerrhon was the aechamenid persian shield - v.similar to the diplyon but made of wicker.

Chariots - got to be careful with the balancing here, as they made the vanilla Egyptian's all powerful in auto-calc.

Maraxus idea of a heavy chariot, designed for close combat like a slow, powerful 'cataphract chariot' sounds good, perhaps with a javelin or two thrown prior to the charge. I don't suppose any other mods have a 4 horse/3 man model you could 'borrow'?

Dime - as you have already said, BI has some usable Berber models to fill up the light infantry ranks + Saba will have the bedouin/desert aOR

The name Zarax suggested - Temple Guards - sounds great for any elite infantry unit.

[Zarax]

I'd rather have light chariots for them, armour and desert don't match...

[Kara Kolyo]

armour and desert don't match...

You should tell that to the catapharcts
Is there an option to make an AOR version for the indo-hellenic hopplites in Bactra, or it will make this region way too powerfull?
A unit that i would like to suggest is some kind of Caucassian sword or axemen. the barcanian horsemen model could be used or the gaul swordsmen with shirt and other shield maybe. the unit could be made little stronger than the hillmen

[Zarax]

Armenia and Pontus could get a modified version of the legionaries...