Sister Sites Idea - the forums.

[Elrond]

Paradox and TW are close enough that they could be considered competition... publishers care little for semantics and the last thing we want to do is drive a wedge between TWC and CA. I doubt Paradox would mind, but we have no reason to toe the line of affiliate status if other options are available. As for the issue of a forum vs. domain, I will respond in the other thread (actually I did but some combination of keys I pressed exited the damn window).

If are affiliate status is at risk then the discussion should end now - it isn't at risk and CA cant expect TWC not to expand into other games - it is the natural progression for the site.

[Kanaric]

Would CA really be that upset over this? I dont see how they try to undermine this simply because we want to appeal to fans from a different game.

Thats just it, its just adding some appeal to fans of a different game. Where not doing to to get people to play Paradox's products. To show this even further that is why a new sister site would be needed. They have to be kept separate in that regard. If they are considered two separate sites but with somewhat conjoined forums I dont see what business it is of theirs when your still promoting their products on the old and more established twcenter site.

If CA attacks the site for that they sure are a petty company and definitely would prove the ages old discussion that always resurfaces of them not caring about their fanbase to be true so I doubt they would do anything so long as there is a line between the two.

If are affiliate status is at risk then the discussion should end now - it isn't at risk and CA cant expect TWC not to expand into other games - it is the natural progression for the site.

If its at risk for paradox it is for any game, so if thats is why not to do it then we may as well stop now. Paradox is hardly a threat to CA, the only threat to CA is their own games as they pretty much have a monopoly on their type of game play. No other game has the campaign map/battles that Total War has.



I just simply dont see this as a factor. Any game added to this site can be seen as a threat to CA sales regardless of the genre. Anything that takes focus off of their product could lose us affiliate status. I think this better be taken up with whoever has contacts on this site with CA.

Also what does this status give the site?

[Elrond]

Would CA really be that upset over this? I dont see how they try to undermine this simply because we want to appeal to fans from a different game.

Thats just it, its just adding some appeal to fans of a different game. Where not doing to to get people to play Paradox's products. To show this even further that is why a new sister site would be needed. They have to be kept separate in that regard. If they are considered two separate sites but with somewhat conjoined forums I dont see what business it is of theirs when your still promoting their products on the old and more established twcenter site.

If CA attacks the site for that they sure are a petty company and definitely would prove the ages old discussion that always resurfaces of them not caring about their fanbase to be true so I doubt they would do anything so long as there is a line between the two.

If its at risk for paradox it is for any game, so if thats is why not to do it then we may as well stop now. Paradox is hardly a threat to CA, the only threat to CA is their own games as they pretty much have a monopoly on their type of game play. No other game has the campaign map/battles that Total War has.

I agree

Also I strongly doubt that CA will want to cut connections with TWC for expanding into other games - the current relationship is mutually beneficial.

[Professor420]

As I said, Kanaric, publishers care little for semantics... they are both strategy games, that is all that matters.

As for what the line is... I can't see CA causing a fuss unless it had a reason to, it is alot of trouble and bad press. BUT, I would rather not create a cojoined TWC/Paradox forum and give CA a card to use if it came to that. The sites can be close, use the same resources, cross link and cross reference, etc., but I would think CA's affiliate clauses rule out a cojoined site (and I would argue that logic rules out a Paradox subforum).

[Kanaric]

What are the terms of our relationship with them?

edit: Someone should ask CA about this, who has contact with them or who manages that relationship? We have to carefully word this as well so dont send anything now.

I think the entire success on any expansion site would rely on it tying in with these forums. So I dont see how they can be separated easily unless you can explain some way to have some parts the same and others not?

Like the Thema Devia and all that HAS to be the same on all sites the way i'm thinking and accounts have to go across them all as well.

[Professor420]

Publius is our liason, IIRC.

I think this may be something better left unsaid, though, unless we have a clear reason to bring it up. I can almost guarantee, if this question is passed up the chain of command from Shogun or Caliban or whoever to SEGA, we are going to get stomped.

[Kanaric]

I find it strange though that they would do something like that to a fansite.

Especially since the vault sites, for example, are doing EXACTLY what this plan is. They get into betas and get previews and interviews all the time. There are many sites that operate like this.

They wouldn't know our thinking, what if this is something were doing no matter what? Would they attack and potentially lose everyones trust, or take away only to have another debacle like when they got lawyers after this site?

How does this affiliation even benefit this site?

edit: I'm wondering if the people who thought up this concept in the first place had this in mind?

[imb39]

ON were moving in the direction of merging all the sites so that the off topic stuff was in one place but the other areas had their own sites. It was not well received by any of their satellite sites at all, from my understanding.

If you want completely separate sites, but one where members belong to all (does this make sense) it might work. I wonder if it will fracture things rather than allow TWC develop...

The technical difficulties must also be considered - it is dair to say we are lucky to have both Sim and Mim but they are taken up maintianing and developing things here. I might be totally missing the point, if so, please accept my apologies.

[Kanaric]

If you want completely separate sites, but one where members belong to all (does this make sense) it might work. I wonder if it will fracture things rather than allow TWC develop...

That is the plan that I favor. Unlike ONs plan were not merging communities, were creating a new one so there isn't preexisting people. Anyone coming would be entirely new to this site understanding the leadership and forum rules from the start.

Basically it would keep things more together, actually, as the off topic forums would all be involved in one and fans of multiple games would be able to post with one account across everything.

I think it would help to develop one large community. Fracturing it would result from separate forums I feel.

You see how the Thema Devia is now, where it has the main forum and subforums. If we were to add paradox games or others that might be a good way to design it. I think that is best for not having like too many forums on the main forum page and people can go directly to what they want to see.

Like with paradox you could have:

General Paradox Games Discussion
- Hoi2
--mods
--after action reports
--multipler
- Etc
- etc
- etc

That kind of design.

http://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/
their site is actually organized like this, they have othe titles aside from their own there as well.

[Darkragnar]

The only reason i can see for CA to cause a fuss is that Once we start Devoting our time on other games we are no longer a Total War fansite we become something more than that and CA as a company awards Gold Status to only the most dedicated Fan Sites and rightly so, it is a Fan site they are looking for and once we come out of the Total War fansite we might stand to loose their interest.

[Lusted]

Copy and paste from pm to Kanaric as i now have access(ty Mim):

Gold Affiliate status gives TWC access to the SEGA press vault(reminds me i must ask Publius if he's got access to it as i forgot what the password was when i left even though i could still acess the site) so we get new screenshots and previews/videos the same time as gaming webistes, though unfortunately we haven't taken that much advantage of it. It also lets us take part in the Gold Code days(which there will be more of), and CA definitely seems to be moving in the direction of trying to give more benefits for Gold Affiliate status.

The main problem i could see happening is if TWC become StrategyCenter, one site with both Paradox and CA games forums. Then we would not be a dedicated TW site and would likely lose Gold Affiliate status. If the site extension is in the form of a new site with it's own forum but user database linked to TWC, then i wouldn't think there would be a problem as there would be TWC, and StrategyCenter, with only user database shared.

It all depends on how it's done.

[Elrond]

Copy and paste from pm to Kanaric as i now have access(ty Mim):

Gold Affiliate status gives TWC access to the SEGA press vault(reminds me i must ask Publius if he's got access to it as i forgot what the password was when i left even though i could still acess the site) so we get new screenshots and previews/videos the same time as gaming webistes, though unfortunately we haven't taken that much advantage of it. It also lets us take part in the Gold Code days(which there will be more of), and CA definitely seems to be moving in the direction of trying to give more benefits for Gold Affiliate status.

The main problem i could see happening is if TWC become StrategyCenter, one site with both Paradox and CA games forums. Then we would not be a dedicated TW site and would likely lose Gold Affiliate status. If the site extension is in the form of a new site with it's own forum but user database linked to TWC, then i wouldn't think there would be a problem as there would be TWC, and StrategyCenter, with only user database shared.

It all depends on how it's done.

thats another argument for a new site - it reduces the risk of losing TWCs gold affiliate status to virtually nil- a new site with a joint user database, the same tech staff and under imb and possibly Hex's control but with a different staff system, different forums and with no link to the curia, would be acceptable to CA and if it was organised properly it would work.

I think creating forums for other games at TWC is a bad idea - it dillutes the meaning of the site, it wont encourage new members to join and if it was successful it could lose TWC its gold affiliate status.

[Leonidas The Lion]

thats another argument for a new site - it reduces the risk of losing TWCs gold affiliate status to virtually nil- a new site with a joint user database, the same tech staff and under imb and possibly Hex's control but with a different staff system, different forums and with no link to the curia, would be acceptable to CA and if it was organised properly it would work.

I think creating forums for other games at TWC is a bad idea - it dillutes the meaning of the site, it wont encourage new members to join and if it was successful it could lose TWC its gold affiliate status.

As I agree with what is said we must take into account that we need to test this as Garb said lets set up a forum so that we could see if people are attracted then we can see about creating new websites although i see that is most likely the path we shall take in the long run.

[Elrond]

As I agree with what is said we must take into account that we need to test this as Garb said lets set up a forum so that we could see if people are attracted then we can see about creating new websites although i see that is most likely the path we shall take in the long run.

You have completely missed the point of setting up a site - it will atract people form outside TWC - a forum will attract a small number of people from inside TWC.

As for a forum helping to chose staff for a website (was said in one of the threads recently) its is utter rubbish - a single forum would require one moderator or two at the most - how does this help? - if they were chosen for moderating a game forum here then they would be obvous candidates for jobs at a sister site anyway.

[Professor420]

I've gone through the extensive reasons a subforum here would not work already... I saw no real objections either. All in all I don't see subforums as a trial run a feasible option... perhaps an uber-forum with categories for TW, Paradox, etc., as Mim as suggested and I'll think more on this later, but right now I'm still in favor of a dedicated new site.

[Leonidas The Lion]

I've gone through the extensive reasons a subforum here would not work already... I saw no real objections either. All in all I don't see subforums as a trial run a feasible option... perhaps an uber-forum with categories for TW, Paradox, etc., as Mim as suggested and I'll think more on this later, but right now I'm still in favor of a dedicated new site.

Ok a new site then but where, how, who all these questions need answering before we can set it up.

Will it be independent of TWC or linked?

[Elrond]

Ok a new site then but where, how, who all these questions need answering before we can set it up.

Will it be independent of TWC or linked?

Linked through a joint user data base would be best - it would give the site a huge advantage over any other new site.

See my post in the other main thread.

[Leonidas The Lion]

I saw and i agree linked is the best.

[Gaius Baltar]

Linked through a joint user data base would be best - it would give the site a huge advantage over any other new site.

While the creation of a "sister" site has certain advantages/pitfalls, Im wondering how this enables us to accomplish the main goal of this committee.

A Curial Committee on the expansion of TWC into other games and game series to widen the membership and increase the intake of the site, as per Article 4, Section 2 of the Constitution.

My take on the "sister" site is that this would not accomplish that goal, that is, widening membership and increasing intake of TWC.

Alternatively, you may be suggesting that traffic from the new site will benefit TWC, but I dont see that as an eventual outcome, expecially since the "sister" site will focus on a completely seperate game series.

[Leonidas The Lion]

But if start forums in TWC itself we will loose the Gold affiliate status that we have.